Do You Suffer From Clinical Depression or Bipolar Disorder? - Page 8

Hear Again · 08-03-2008, 06:28 PM

I've read that bipolar worsens with age if medication is not taken. Does anyone (Jillio?) know if that's true?

jazzy · 08-04-2008, 12:01 AM

One more thing, I get moody every time I watch news on TV or read some news online and also watch bloody movie on tv. I get so down by it and stay moody all day. Why bother to pay attention so negatives when we can tune in to postive alike a read a good and positve book or watch good movie. It goes same here on AD, too many negatives here and I never get to feel good after ready posts here. I can not image people with bi-polar to feel down all the time.

Hear Again · 08-04-2008, 12:34 AM

Jazzy,

I agree with you. That's why I deliberately avoid watching the news or disturbing TV programs that will upset me. As for people with bipolar *always* feeling down all the time, some people feel a period of normalcy (i.e. normal mood) in between manic and depressive episodes. In my case, I might experience a manic episode for a week, "crash" (come down -- meaning I feel depressed and/or extremely irritable) and then I feel normal until my next manic or depressive episode. My periods of normalcy can last anywhere from a few days to a few weeks. It just depends on my "triggers" (i.e. not eating, not keeping a consistent sleep schedule -- I have insomnia tonight

, avoiding large crowds and loud noises whenever possible, etc.) and more importantly, what I do to keep my bipolar under control.

jillio · 08-04-2008, 12:51 AM

Yes, it is true that bipolar symptoms worsen with age if not treated, unlike some disorders that get better with age.

SkullChick · 08-04-2008, 10:36 AM

Yeah I know, I just don't think I have bipolar because I don't have severe mood swing like manic hyper and then severly depressed then exploding with anger.
We will find out eventually, thanks

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

It is not unusual for a pattern of mental disorders like you describe to run in families. It is a combination of genetic predisposition, and environmental influences that cause the disorder to manifest. And for the schizophrenic to be non-complaint with medication is also something that is typical of the disease. That fact alone is responsible for repeated hospitilizations.

First degree relatives of a diagnosed schizophrenic (i.e. sons and daughters) have a 10 times greater risk of developing scizophrenia than someone without a parent with the disorder. They also have a greater risk for Schizoaffective Disorder and Schizotypal Personality Disorder. So, given the history that you have just given me, you are at a higher risk. You may be right on target with your diagnosis, but I am glad that you are going for assessment to be certain. There are some symptoms of the various Bi-Polar Disorders that will mimic schizophrenic or schizophrenic spectrum disorders.

I commend you on recognizing that you have some problems, and doing what you can to address them. That takes a great degree of insight and courage. Please know that if you need support, or a place to vent, I am available through P.M.

dreama · 08-04-2008, 03:03 PM

Well I'm not curently on any medicines. I do have mood swings though. I used to take all sorts of medicine but now I've stopped taking all of them except liquid thyroxine as I've been on that since I was 18 months and would be ill without it.

I think today they tend to hand out too many drugs and not try anything like councilling. I didn't even get councilling after mum died of cancer or after experiencing domestic violence. It would have helped.

jillio · 08-05-2008, 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreama

Well I'm not curently on any medicines. I do have mood swings though. I used to take all sorts of medicine but now I've stopped taking all of them except liquid thyroxine as I've been on that since I was 18 months and would be ill without it.

I think today they tend to hand out too many drugs and not try anything like councilling. I didn't even get councilling after mum died of cancer or after experiencing domestic violence. It would have helped.

I have no doubt that counseling would have helped you a great deal at the times you mentioned.

It has been shown many times over, that for those who need meds, the most effective treatments include medications and counseling combined. We seem to have become a population that goes for the "quick fix" though. Take a pill, and you'll be fine!

Hear Again · 08-09-2008, 09:34 PM

Jillio,

In an earlier post, you mentioned schizoaffective disorder. What's the difference between schizoaffective disorder bipolar type and bipolar I with psychotic features? Can some people originally diagnosed as schizoaffective later be diagnosed as bipolar and vice versa?

jillio · 08-10-2008, 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hear Again

Jillio,

In an earlier post, you mentioned schizoaffective disorder. What's the difference between schizoaffective disorder bipolar type and bipolar I with psychotic features? Can some people originally diagnosed as schizoaffective later be diagnosed as bipolar and vice versa?

Schizoaffective disorder bipolar type: the primary diagnosis is the schizoaffective disorder, and the bipolar type is a qualifier. It means that the schizoaffective disorder manifests the same patterns as a bipolar disorder, but does not meet the diagnostic criteria for dx as a bilpolar disorder.

Bipolar I with psychotic features: The primary diagnosis is the Bipolar I disorder, and the psychotic features are secondary to the Bipolar Disorder. The psychotic features in some individuals may mimic the psychotic features of the schizophrenic disorders, but not always. To be diagnosed with one of the schizophrenic disorders, the psychotic features have to fall within strict criteria. Bipolar I with psychotic features may manifest with one or more of the psychotic features seen in a Schizophrenic Disorder, for instance, only auditory hallucinations, or disconnect from reality, or paranoia.

Also, schizoaffective disorder is classified as a psychotic disorder, and Bipolar Dosrder I is classified as a mood disorder, so they are dignosed on a different Axis.

Gets confusing, doesn't it?

And, yes, a diagnosis can change as information becomes more available. An individual may, at the time of assessment, and for a period of time afterward, fit nicely into the diagnostic criteria for schizoaffective because they have been seen during a period of non-medication and are bordering on a psychotic break. As we observe, and gain more information on long standing patterns and behaviors, the primary diagnosis can change. This is done with an addendum to the diagnostic evaluation. We diagnose on 5 different Axis, and it is not unusual to defer one or more of them until we are able to get a clearer, more detailed picture of what is really going on with that individual. With someone who is very ill, that is quite often difficult without extended time. But, in order for that individual to receive treatment, the insurance company must have a diagnosis before treatment is approved.

Hear Again · 08-10-2008, 02:25 PM

Jillio,

Thank you for answering my question. Yes, it does get quite confusing.

The reason I asked is because my hospital discharge paperwork listed my diagnosis as schizoaffective disorder bipolar type.

However, my attending psychiatrist in the hospital as well as my current psychiatrist and therapist all refer to my condition as bipolar. In fact, when I asked the psychiatrist in the hospital what was causing the auditory hallucinations I was hearing, he said "You have something called manic depression."

Now that I'm on medication, the hallucinations are no longer a problem for me, but manic and depressive episodes are. I wonder if that might be one reason why my psychiatrist and therapist now refer to my condition as bipolar and whether or not my diagnosis may have changed to bipolar I or bipolar I with psychotic features?

I've also read that some psychiatrists don't believe in the diagnosis of schizoaffective because there hasn't been alot of reasearch regarding the condition. That leaves me confused as to what my diagnosis really is. Perhaps that's something I'll clarify with my current psychiatrist at my next visit.

Then again, perhaps the diagnosis isn't all that important. What really counts is the fact that my meds are addressing my symptoms the way they should.

jillio · 08-10-2008, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hear Again

Jillio,

Thank you for answering my question. Yes, it does get quite confusing.

The reason I asked is because my hospital discharge paperwork listed my diagnosis as schizoaffective disorder bipolar type.

However, my attending psychiatrist in the hospital as well as my current psychiatrist and therapist all refer to my condition as bipolar. In fact, when I asked the psychiatrist in the hospital what was causing the auditory hallucinations I was hearing, he said "You have something called manic depression."

Now that I'm on medication, the hallucinations are no longer a problem for me, but manic and depressive episodes are. I wonder if that might be one reason why my psychiatrist and therapist now refer to my condition as bipolar and whether or not my diagnosis may have changed to bipolar I or bipolar I with psychotic features?

I've also read that some psychiatrists don't believe in the diagnosis of schizoaffective because there hasn't been alot of reasearch regarding the condition. That leaves me confused as to what my diagnosis really is. Perhaps that's something I'll clarify with my current psychiatrist at my next visit.

Then again, perhaps the diagnosis isn't all that important. What really counts is the fact that my meds are addressing my symptoms the way they should.

Ah, I see. When you were hpspitalized, was it because of the hallucinations? And I agree...the dx doesn't really matter as long as you are getting the help you need.

If you would like, you can pm me, and I will give you the dignostic criteria for Schizoaffective d/o, as well as Bipolar I with psychotic features, and explain the Axis to you.

Hear Again · 08-10-2008, 06:52 PM

Will do. Thanks Jillio.

Hear Again · 08-10-2008, 09:55 PM

Jillio,

I'm sorry I forgot to answer your question. Yes, the hospitalization was due to the hallucinations. I was also reported as being manic and paranoid at the time of my admission. My hospital stay lasted 4 weeks.

jillio · 08-11-2008, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hear Again

Jillio,

I'm sorry I forgot to answer your question. Yes, the hospitalization was due to the hallucinations. I was also reported as being manic and paranoid at the time of my admission. My hospital stay lasted 4 weeks.

Ahh, then the diagnosis was based on the reason for your admission. The hallucinations were the presenting symptom.

jillio · 08-11-2008, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hear Again

Will do. Thanks Jillio.

No problem. Happy to discuss your concerns with you.

Gemma · 08-11-2008, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

I am a big believer in meditation techniques used with a variety of disorders. They are useful especially with depression and anxiety, or the anxiety based disorders such as OCD. I personally, take a very holistic view of treatment, and believe that we need to focus not just on the behavioral and emotional symptoms of these disorders, but on the physical symptoms, as well. I am very Gestalt, and use exercises that employ the use of the body to bring about awareness of what is going on mentally and emotionally with an individual. We all use our bodies to block things that are emotionally painful or uncomfortable for us, and learning relaxation techniques that permit the body to relax will assist in allowing emotional difficulties to come to the surface so that they can be dealt with. A relaxed individual is much more capable of becoming aware of the ways in which they are blocking themselves. Meditation is an excellent tool for this goal.

Granted, guided meditation does traditionally have an oral component. However, deaf individuals can be taught visualization techniques that serve the same purpose, but with internal guidance from the individual rather than spoken guidance from a clinician. My goal is to teach the individual how to do for themselves what they come to me to do for them. I am an educator at heart, and believe that all people are capable of nurturing and tending to their needs if they only have the knowledge of how to do so. I don't want my clients to be dependent upon me. I want to provide them with the tools to be able to depend on themselves.

You have certainly given me something to ponder. I need to come up with a way to make the many self-help materials that are available more deaf friendly. Thank you for making me aware of something I should have considered long ago. Its a perfect example of why the deaf community is a valuable resource for me. You, and only you, can make me aware of what you need.

I wish I could be taught visualization techniques by you or at least someone with knowledge of ASL and deaf community - I read the book that I mentioned earlier and wow, it has certainly helped me so much. Nowadays, I pay more attention to being in present rather than ruminating - ruminating is my downfall - I try to steer myself away from ruminating and I find myself improving but that is just one of many tools to manage this disease. I will continue to remind myself everyday to be more mindful of everything I do, feel, eat and think.

Fortunately there are many books out there on this process that I could pick up and read but I wish that there is a layman familiar with Deaf Community and its unique language needs and mediation who can bring both together in a way that all Deaf people can benefit from. I think there is a DVD out there that teaches deaf people how to mediate but I cannot recall - do you know anything about this?

jillio · 08-11-2008, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gemma

I wish I could be taught visualization techniques by you or at least someone with knowledge of ASL and deaf community - I read the book that I mentioned earlier and wow, it has certainly helped me so much. Nowadays, I pay more attention to being in present rather than ruminating - ruminating is my downfall - I try to steer myself away from ruminating and I find myself improving but that is just one of many tools to manage this disease. I will continue to remind myself everyday to be more mindful of everything I do, feel, eat and think.

Fortunately there are many books out there on this process that I could pick up and read but I wish that there is a layman familiar with Deaf Community and its unique language needs and mediation who can bring both together in a way that all Deaf people can benefit from. I think there is a DVD out there that teaches deaf people how to mediate but I cannot recall - do you know anything about this?

I am not aware of a DVD, but I have already started brainstorming with my Ph.D. advisor regarding some of the issues you have mentioned.

Ay, yes, rumination! We all get caught up in it from time to time, and it is a big obstacle. One of the things I like about a Gestalt approach is that it keeps the client in the "here and now" while allowing them to complete unfinished past business that prevents full functioning in the "here and now". Our past has a profound impact on our present and our future, and only by dealing with the past can we improve current functioning. However, rather than ruminating, we need to address it as it affects us today, deal with it, and complete the gestalt.

I would encourage you to continue with that mindfulness. It is the best path to self awareness, and self awareness is the key to healing.

There is a saying I have heard in relation to rumination and projection: "If you live with one foot in yesterday, and one foot in tomorrow, you piss all over today."

AquaBlue · 08-12-2008, 09:10 AM

Can cognitive theory minimize my intake of meds or is bipolar just a chemical disorder that requires medication (only) as treatment?

I see my head doctor tomorrow afternoon. I will ask him in session.

jillio · 08-12-2008, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AquaBlue

Can cognitive theory minimize my intake of meds or is bipolar just a chemical disorder that requires medication (only) as treatment?

I see my head doctor tomorrow afternoon. I will ask him in session.

Meds are necessary to level you out. Therapy is necessary to improve day to day functioning, and to give you the skills to effectively deal with your disorder. Therapy and meds together are much more effective than one or the other alone.

08-03-2008, 06:28 PM	#211 (permalink)
Hear Again Proud Beeper/5150 Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Wisconsin and my own little manic world... Posts: 7,334	I've read that bipolar worsens with age if medication is not taken. Does anyone (Jillio?) know if that's true? __________________ Left ear - Nucleus 24 Contour Advance with Freedom BTE (Implanted: 12/22/04 \| Activated: 1/18/05) Right ear - Nucleus Freedom (Implanted: 2/1/06 \| Activated: 3/1/06) Deafblind/Postlingual What is bipolar disorder? What are the different types of bipolar disorder? "All things are difficult before they are easy." -- Thomas Fuller

08-04-2008, 12:01 AM	#212 (permalink)
jazzy Registered User Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 3,196	One more thing, I get moody every time I watch news on TV or read some news online and also watch bloody movie on tv. I get so down by it and stay moody all day. Why bother to pay attention so negatives when we can tune in to postive alike a read a good and positve book or watch good movie. It goes same here on AD, too many negatives here and I never get to feel good after ready posts here. I can not image people with bi-polar to feel down all the time. __________________

08-04-2008, 12:34 AM	#213 (permalink)
Hear Again Proud Beeper/5150 Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Wisconsin and my own little manic world... Posts: 7,334	Jazzy, I agree with you. That's why I deliberately avoid watching the news or disturbing TV programs that will upset me. As for people with bipolar always feeling down all the time, some people feel a period of normalcy (i.e. normal mood) in between manic and depressive episodes. In my case, I might experience a manic episode for a week, "crash" (come down -- meaning I feel depressed and/or extremely irritable) and then I feel normal until my next manic or depressive episode. My periods of normalcy can last anywhere from a few days to a few weeks. It just depends on my "triggers" (i.e. not eating, not keeping a consistent sleep schedule -- I have insomnia tonight , avoiding large crowds and loud noises whenever possible, etc.) and more importantly, what I do to keep my bipolar under control. __________________ Left ear - Nucleus 24 Contour Advance with Freedom BTE (Implanted: 12/22/04 \| Activated: 1/18/05) Right ear - Nucleus Freedom (Implanted: 2/1/06 \| Activated: 3/1/06) Deafblind/Postlingual What is bipolar disorder? What are the different types of bipolar disorder? "All things are difficult before they are easy." -- Thomas Fuller

08-04-2008, 03:03 PM	#216 (permalink)
dreama deafblind vegan Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: England Posts: 1,070	Well I'm not curently on any medicines. I do have mood swings though. I used to take all sorts of medicine but now I've stopped taking all of them except liquid thyroxine as I've been on that since I was 18 months and would be ill without it. I think today they tend to hand out too many drugs and not try anything like councilling. I didn't even get councilling after mum died of cancer or after experiencing domestic violence. It would have helped. __________________ I speak for those who cannot speak for themselves. http://www.fightfoca.com/

08-09-2008, 09:34 PM	#218 (permalink)
Hear Again Proud Beeper/5150 Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Wisconsin and my own little manic world... Posts: 7,334	Jillio, In an earlier post, you mentioned schizoaffective disorder. What's the difference between schizoaffective disorder bipolar type and bipolar I with psychotic features? Can some people originally diagnosed as schizoaffective later be diagnosed as bipolar and vice versa? __________________ Left ear - Nucleus 24 Contour Advance with Freedom BTE (Implanted: 12/22/04 \| Activated: 1/18/05) Right ear - Nucleus Freedom (Implanted: 2/1/06 \| Activated: 3/1/06) Deafblind/Postlingual What is bipolar disorder? What are the different types of bipolar disorder? "All things are difficult before they are easy." -- Thomas Fuller

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08-04-2008, 12:51 AM	#214 (permalink)
jillio Banned Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 21,197	Yes, it is true that bipolar symptoms worsen with age if not treated, unlike some disorders that get better with age.

08-10-2008, 02:25 PM	#220 (permalink)
Hear Again Proud Beeper/5150 Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Wisconsin and my own little manic world... Posts: 7,334	Jillio, Thank you for answering my question. Yes, it does get quite confusing. The reason I asked is because my hospital discharge paperwork listed my diagnosis as schizoaffective disorder bipolar type. However, my attending psychiatrist in the hospital as well as my current psychiatrist and therapist all refer to my condition as bipolar. In fact, when I asked the psychiatrist in the hospital what was causing the auditory hallucinations I was hearing, he said "You have something called manic depression." Now that I'm on medication, the hallucinations are no longer a problem for me, but manic and depressive episodes are. I wonder if that might be one reason why my psychiatrist and therapist now refer to my condition as bipolar and whether or not my diagnosis may have changed to bipolar I or bipolar I with psychotic features? I've also read that some psychiatrists don't believe in the diagnosis of schizoaffective because there hasn't been alot of reasearch regarding the condition. That leaves me confused as to what my diagnosis really is. Perhaps that's something I'll clarify with my current psychiatrist at my next visit. Then again, perhaps the diagnosis isn't all that important. What really counts is the fact that my meds are addressing my symptoms the way they should. __________________ Left ear - Nucleus 24 Contour Advance with Freedom BTE (Implanted: 12/22/04 \| Activated: 1/18/05) Right ear - Nucleus Freedom (Implanted: 2/1/06 \| Activated: 3/1/06) Deafblind/Postlingual What is bipolar disorder? What are the different types of bipolar disorder? "All things are difficult before they are easy." -- Thomas Fuller Last edited by Hear Again; 08-10-2008 at 03:13 PM.

08-10-2008, 06:52 PM	#222 (permalink)
Hear Again Proud Beeper/5150 Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Wisconsin and my own little manic world... Posts: 7,334	Will do. Thanks Jillio. __________________ Left ear - Nucleus 24 Contour Advance with Freedom BTE (Implanted: 12/22/04 \| Activated: 1/18/05) Right ear - Nucleus Freedom (Implanted: 2/1/06 \| Activated: 3/1/06) Deafblind/Postlingual What is bipolar disorder? What are the different types of bipolar disorder? "All things are difficult before they are easy." -- Thomas Fuller

08-10-2008, 09:55 PM	#223 (permalink)
Hear Again Proud Beeper/5150 Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Wisconsin and my own little manic world... Posts: 7,334	Jillio, I'm sorry I forgot to answer your question. Yes, the hospitalization was due to the hallucinations. I was also reported as being manic and paranoid at the time of my admission. My hospital stay lasted 4 weeks. __________________ Left ear - Nucleus 24 Contour Advance with Freedom BTE (Implanted: 12/22/04 \| Activated: 1/18/05) Right ear - Nucleus Freedom (Implanted: 2/1/06 \| Activated: 3/1/06) Deafblind/Postlingual What is bipolar disorder? What are the different types of bipolar disorder? "All things are difficult before they are easy." -- Thomas Fuller Last edited by Hear Again; 08-10-2008 at 10:34 PM.

08-12-2008, 09:10 AM	#228 (permalink)
AquaBlue ASL Student Join Date: May 2003 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 1,378	Can cognitive theory minimize my intake of meds or is bipolar just a chemical disorder that requires medication (only) as treatment? I see my head doctor tomorrow afternoon. I will ask him in session. __________________ Currently Reading: The Story of Edgar Sawtelle by David Wroblewski My Book List My Bipolar Page

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