Designing A Hearing Baby - Page 8

shel90 · 09-16-2007, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gemma

I totally agree with this. I got implanted 3 years ago and I know I am not reaping as much as these younger people - for example, my deaf niece got implanted at age 4, she shows remarkably more benefits than I do.

That is why this debate is fascinating to me - I feel that most people are missing the point that the younger the one recieves a CI, the MORE benefits that person will recieve but so many deaf parents say Wait until they are old enough to tell me - but by then (that is if they do), they will miss out on these crucial years of brain/language development.

I am only interested to see that ALL deaf people get ALL tools and figure out which tool works..frankly I am tired of reading or hearing how people argue that this tool works better or that works better whereas only one person will ever know..which is that user. Perspectives will always be colored if looking at that person - only that person will know if it works or not. It involves so many aspects - some overlapping, some not...it is virtually impossible to determine if it will work for that particular person based on another person's experience so I think it is time that people stop arguing and work together!!!!!!!!!

What do u mean the child will miss out on crucial years of language development? What about ASL?

Cloggy · 09-16-2007, 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

There's the problem....you can't read! #2 is a specific question. Notice the way it is phrased and the ? at the end.

Poor Jillio....
But like you stated elsewhere.... some people need to be shocked....

Here's Post#2...

Quote:

Originally Posted by R2D2

I think Sweetmind already posted this? You can read her thread which was closed (surprise surprise) to get an idea of how people feel about it.

Well, all I can say it's controversial whether a baby is implanted at 6 months or at age 3 and sometimes even when the deaf person is an adult making their own choice. You can't make everyone or every group happy in life as we are all very diverse. I'd say research whatever you do extensively and make an informed choice that is best for you, your family and your child.

I did notice the phrasing, but have a hard time finding the "?" at the end. I cannot see the question you are talking about, but then, English is not my first language. But then again, I don't think the problem is on my side.

Now, please... find a specialist.

Cloggy · 09-16-2007, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gemma

I totally agree with this. I got implanted 3 years ago and I know I am not reaping as much as these younger people - for example, my deaf niece got implanted at age 4, she shows remarkably more benefits than I do.

That is why this debate is fascinating to me - I feel that most people are missing the point that the younger the one recieves a CI, the MORE benefits that person will recieve but so many deaf parents say Wait until they are old enough to tell me - but by then (that is if they do), they will miss out on these crucial years of brain/language development.

I am only interested to see that ALL deaf people get ALL tools and figure out which tool works..frankly I am tired of reading or hearing how people argue that this tool works better or that works better whereas only one person will ever know..which is that user. Perspectives will always be colored if looking at that person - only that person will know if it works or not. It involves so many aspects - some overlapping, some not...it is virtually impossible to determine if it will work for that particular person based on another person's experience so I think it is time that people stop arguing and work together!!!!!!!!!

Gemma,
Thanks for sharing that personal experience.
I hope to hear more about your and your nieces experiences. Perhaps in your own thread.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shel90

What do u mean the child will miss out on crucial years of language development? What about ASL?

I'm sure she meant hearing and speech, considering Gemma is talking about CI.
You didn't get that?

Cloggy · 09-16-2007, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tousi

Unless you were late-deafened at, ummm, say, age 28...auditory memory would be a powerful factor.

True. Whenever language has been established, the auditory memory would be an important factor. So, even children at age 6 do really well.

Gemma · 09-16-2007, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shel90

What do u mean the child will miss out on crucial years of language development? What about ASL?

shel - I am referring to speech and listening.

Because I have an older deaf brother, my mother was especially alert to see if I am deaf as well when I was first born. Due to that, they gave me HAs, put me in speech therapy and lipreading sessions at age of 12 months. Back in 1968, that was an unusual experiement because they didnt catch hearing losses early enough to implement early intervention in pre-lingually stage.

Thus I was the youngest child in California history to begin early invention. There were a few articles on me. How they got me to cooperate was to give me a piece of sugary cereal

for every sound I made, etc. Did I like it? No but I didnt understand. I hated every minute of these daily sessions but I am grateful to this day that I was given the opportunity.

Anyhow, if anyone can compare me and my brother due to early intervention, it is clearly obvious that I benefitted a great deal more than him in terms of lipreading and speech as he didnt start until age of 2.

My brother decided to implant his deaf daughter at age 4 - he was conflicted - he thought he would let his daughter grow up to decide but he realized that his daughter would miss out so much as all young children develop languages so quickly in parallel to their brain development - whether it is speech or even ASL. He is allowing his daughter to learn ASL so his daughter could have all tools which my brother and I didnt have.

I didnt learn ASL until in my late 20s so that is why I cannot grasp ASL as fast as I would like to because my brain is not working quickly as when I was much much younger. I still stumble over it. I am sure it would be the other way around for someone who had to start learning lipreading or speech in late 20s too.

I do wish I was given ALL tools - that is why I really advocate for it because there is no such thing as the perfect tool but there is a such thing as right timing, to be given all tools at a very young age.

Just wish that there is no black or white here...we all would benefit so much if everyone looks in the gray area.

deafskeptic · 09-16-2007, 02:44 PM

Your brother implanted his daughter? I wonder how the local deaf community reacted to that one. My only concern is that the daughter gets the full toolbox and I think it's really AWESOME she's getting it.

shel90 · 09-16-2007, 02:48 PM

[quote=Cloggy;838219]Gemma,
Thanks for sharing that personal experience.
I hope to hear more about your and your nieces experiences. Perhaps in your own thread.

I'm sure she meant hearing and speech, considering Gemma is talking about CI.
You didn't get that?[/QUOTE]

Would rather ask before making assumptions.

Gemma · 09-16-2007, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafskeptic

Your brother implanted his daughter? I wonder how the local deaf community reacted to that one. My only concern is that the daughter gets the full toolbox and I think it's really AWESOME she's getting it.

Yes it caused a lot of negative talks but both my brother and his ex wife dismissed all (she is deaf too) and wanted to give her all tools.

Thus she seems comfortable in both worlds. At least she has all communication tools to pick one out when communicating with anyone, whether it be a hearing or deaf person. Her CI may not have worked but at least she had sign language to fall on but it sems to be working for her so far. She is now 13.

So why cant all deaf babies be given all tools and see which one he/she benefits most from? If all, great, if not at least have something. Why forbid a child a CI and insist on ASL only or forbid a child to learn ASL but rely on CI? Cant they have all? Let them experiment and see what happens down the road. It is a long journey.

shel90 · 09-16-2007, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gemma

shel - I am referring to speech and listening.

Because I have an older deaf brother, my mother was especially alert to see if I am deaf as well when I was first born. Due to that, they gave me HAs, put me in speech therapy and lipreading sessions at age of 12 months. Back in 1968, that was an unusual experiement because they didnt catch hearing losses early enough to implement early intervention in pre-lingually stage.

Thus I was the youngest child in California history to begin early invention. There were a few articles on me. How they got me to cooperate was to give me a piece of sugary cereal

for every sound I made, etc. Did I like it? No but I didnt understand. I hated every minute of these daily sessions but I am grateful to this day that I was given the opportunity.

Anyhow, if anyone can compare me and my brother due to early intervention, it is clearly obvious that I benefitted a great deal more than him in terms of lipreading and speech as he didnt start until age of 2.

My brother decided to implant his deaf daughter at age 4 - he was conflicted - he thought he would let his daughter grow up to decide but he realized that his daughter would miss out so much as all young children develop languages so quickly in parallel to their brain development - whether it is speech or even ASL. He is allowing his daughter to learn ASL so his daughter could have all tools which my brother and I didnt have.

I didnt learn ASL until in my late 20s so that is why I cannot grasp ASL as fast as I would like to because my brain is not working quickly as when I was much much younger. I still stumble over it. I am sure it would be the other way around for someone who had to start learning lipreading or speech in late 20s too.

I do wish I was given ALL tools - that is why I really advocate for it because there is no such thing as the perfect tool but there is a such thing as right timing, to be given all tools at a very young age.

Just wish that there is no black or white here...we all would benefit so much if everyone looks in the gray area.

Ok thanks for clarifying.

That's why I believe in the BiBi approach using both sign and spoken languages. As for hearing devices, I dont have deaf children so I cant pass judgement on people who decide to or to not implant their children. I have always said and still do that it is the family's business and decision. I just dont want any deaf children to get deprived of language..that's my agenda.

Gemma · 09-16-2007, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shel90

Ok thanks for clarifying.

That's why I believe in the BiBi approach using both sign and spoken languages. As for hearing devices, I dont have deaf children so I cant pass judgement on people who decide to or to not implant their children. I have always said and still do that it is the family's business and decision. I just dont want any deaf children to get deprived of language..that's my agenda.

Now this is where I have to be careful - dont want to assume - what is your definition of language? Deprived of what language?

shel90 · 09-16-2007, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gemma

Now this is where I have to be careful - dont want to assume - what is your definition of language? Deprived of what language?

any language...many deaf children are usually exposed to oral only and then later on when they are older, they are not hitting the language milestones appropriate for their age, they get introduced to ASL but most of them struggle since the critical years of language development has passed. I see so many kids get referred to our school at elementary age with a language level of 2 or 3 years old.

Gemma · 09-16-2007, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shel90

any language...many deaf children are usually exposed to oral only and then later on when they are older, they are not hitting the language milestones appropriate for their age, they get introduced to ASL but most of them struggle since the critical years of language development has passed. I see so many kids get referred to our school at elementary age with a language level of 2 or 3 years old.

Exactly that is why I advocate all tools! Why must it be either CI or ASL ..cant they have it all? But in order to have more benefits with a CI, it needs to be implanted at a very very young age - same goes with learning sign language. So I do not agree with the viewpoint "Let a child decide and tell me when she/he wants a CI.".

shel90 · 09-16-2007, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gemma

Exactly that is why I advocate all tools! Why must it be either CI or ASL ..cant they have it all? But in order to have more benefits with a CI, it needs to be implanted at a very very young age - same goes with learning sign language. So I do not agree with the viewpoint "Let a child decide and tell me when she/he wants a CI.".

I have no problem with that view.

It doesnt have to be either CI or ASL, at least not with me but many people seem to think that I am against CIs. Oh well. This year I have a student who benefits from her CI. In the past I always got the students who didnt benefit from their CIs.

PuyoPiyo · 09-16-2007, 03:14 PM

Wow I am so past on this thread..

I have to DISAGREE with this! What if the baby grow and have bigger head, then that baby will have head problem, even it could risk baby's brain that could kill the baby!

Leave the baby alone and let it grow first. Surgical Produces is very LASTLY decision for the newborn babies.

shel90 · 09-16-2007, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PuyoPiyo

Wow I am so past on this thread..

I have to DISAGREE with this! What if the baby grow and have bigger head, then that baby will have head problem, even it could risk baby's brain that could kill the baby!

Leave the baby alone and let it grow first. Surgical Produces is very LASTLY decision for the newborn babies.

U got a CI as a baby right?

PuyoPiyo · 09-16-2007, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shel90

U got a CI as a baby right?

No lol I got it last year at my 19th age and rare use it.

shel90 · 09-16-2007, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PuyoPiyo

No lol I got it last year at my 19th age and rare use it.

So why didnt it work for u? Since some people want on info on why CIs dont work for some people, maybe u can give one of the many examples? Was it your age or the device itself?

Gemma · 09-16-2007, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PuyoPiyo

Wow I am so past on this thread..

I have to DISAGREE with this! What if the baby grow and have bigger head, then that baby will have head problem, even it could risk baby's brain that could kill the baby!

Leave the baby alone and let it grow first. Surgical Produces is very LASTLY decision for the newborn babies.

What do you mean? It is implanted right behind the ear - very tiny device - it has nothing to do with growth of the head. It will never affect the physical growth of the head.

So you are saying if a baby with a heart problem or something like that shouldnt have surgeries too?

PuyoPiyo · 09-16-2007, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shel90

So why didnt it work for u? Since some people want on info on why CIs dont work for some people, maybe u can give one of the many examples? Was it your age or the device itself?

Well I already post the reason several times around here, anyway here I go.

Before I got CI, I was very into Japanese language and I thought if I can get CI then I can learn Japanese speaking.

Thus I got surgery and got CI, and found out it was all mistake for me. I raise whole of my life as deaf and only sign or read lips, never use the hearing aids since I was 12. I can hear lot of stuff very clearly but CI is giving me weird feelings on my head, like sounds coming out in the area between my nose and mouth (which is hurtful and makes me want to get it off NOW) because my brain don't know where to put the sounds, also the sounds tend to get on my nerve even though I put it all way down, it still give me headaches and weird feelings. Also the metal inside my head is not convience for me, when I itch on it, I barely can feel my skin and also if I do anything to the metal on my head, it will make my ear ringing which are annoying.

So that's why I rare use it, mostly I use it when I went to movie theater or visiting to my family members who desire for me to use it. Also it is annoying when my hearing family kept begging me to use the CI.

There is just some of things I regret about receive the CI, but there is other thing I like about CI although.

Gemma · 09-16-2007, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shel90

I have no problem with that view.

It doesnt have to be either CI or ASL, at least not with me but many people seem to think that I am against CIs. Oh well. This year I have a student who benefits from her CI. In the past I always got the students who didnt benefit from their CIs.

Got a question - you work at a mainstreamed program or a school for the deaf?

PuyoPiyo · 09-16-2007, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gemma

What do you mean? It is implanted right behind the ear - very tiny device - it has nothing to do with growth of the head. It will never affect the physical growth of the head.

So you are saying if a baby with a heart problem or something like that shouldnt have surgeries too?

Yes it do, sorry. Head have skull, that's where the implant is drilled on and the cochlea where the implant go inside. Look at the size of adult's head/ear system and baby's head/ear system. Baby's head is very small, soft, and WEAK. It's far more risk for the baby to take the unnecessary surgery like the CI than those who are older. If I was parents who want a hearing child, I would wait till the baby grow up to like maybe 4-5 years old then I will go for the CI.

Heart problem situation is different than the CI. CI is not really necessary which you can wait till the baby develop its own body the healthy way. Heart problem is one of urgency surgical produces, CI surgical produce is not.

I just prefer to hold a happy healthy baby. A baby that being deaf does not mean the baby is unhealthy.

Liebling:-))) · 09-16-2007, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gemma

So you are saying if a baby with a heart problem or something like that shouldnt have surgeries too?

Are you saying that deaf is a diease and risk life saving emergency as heart, etc?

Gemma · 09-16-2007, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liebling:-)))

Are you saying that deaf is a diease and risk life saving emergency as heart, etc?

Oh no not at all! I am only referring to the surgery part - I never will think deafness is a disease. It is not a life threatening disease

My point is that if people can do surgeries on babies, CI is one of them - so what is difference between implanting a CI and something else in a baby? Why do people scream abuse if implant a CI in a baby but not say anything if do surgery on something else on a baby? *just curious*

09-16-2007, 02:44 PM	#216 (permalink)
deafskeptic AAACCK! I got BORGED! Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 2,282	Your brother implanted his daughter? I wonder how the local deaf community reacted to that one. My only concern is that the daughter gets the full toolbox and I think it's really AWESOME she's getting it. __________________ Left ear implanted with Med-El on April 24 2007. Activated on May 9th.

09-16-2007, 02:48 PM	#217 (permalink)
shel90 Sun Whorshipper Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: A Desert Rat that has found herself in Maryland Posts: 13,775 Blog Entries: 1	[quote=Cloggy;838219]Gemma, Thanks for sharing that personal experience. I hope to hear more about your and your nieces experiences. Perhaps in your own thread. I'm sure she meant hearing and speech, considering Gemma is talking about CI. You didn't get that?[/QUOTE] Would rather ask before making assumptions. __________________ ~Shel~

09-16-2007, 03:14 PM	#224 (permalink)
PuyoPiyo slotting Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Fourth Plain Village WA Posts: 4,810	Wow I am so past on this thread.. I *have to* DISAGREE with this! What if the baby grow and have bigger head, then that baby will have head problem, even it could risk baby's brain that could kill the baby! Leave the baby alone and let it grow first. Surgical Produces is very LASTLY decision for the newborn babies. __________________ Finally found Ruby, my puppy See this thread for more info. http://www.alldeaf.com/our-pets/5515...ml#post1049543 NOTE I will be gone on September 10 to 21 working on my temporary job @ out of the town, so just let everyone know

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