FLDS--Standoff in Texas. - Page 2

Miss-Delectable · 04-20-2008, 02:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

I have a good friend that works at a treatment center designed to treat ex-cult members. They get people from all over the world. It is the only mental health facility in the world that specializes in this kind of treatment.

I've been talking to her quite a bit since the children were taken from the ranch. She seems to think that they have a very good chance for recovery if they are provided with the proper support and treatment, but it will take awhile. All of the media attention and court cases, etc. just serve to reinforce everything they have been taught about the outside world right at first. A therapist has to be able to develop trust with a client, and it takes a long time to get an ex-cult member to trust anyone outside the cult.

I find the whole situation to be incredibly sad. I have visited the facility where she works, and they do amazing work for people like this.

Wow, that's great about the center. Why on the earth have not they created more of those center around America, or more specifically the world. Is there much demand for that kind of help?

I hope for those FLDS kids that they'll have years worth of counselling and reprogramming. They better not be dumped on people who doesn't know how to look after them. Or worse, take advantage of their naivety.

sara1981 · 04-20-2008, 02:59 AM

people cover magazines of FLDS in Texas its would be so exclusives! if you get that magazines at groceries or book stores

Chrysanthe · 04-21-2008, 10:34 AM

When we learned about this incident, I was nauseated how these people are allowing these children to go through horrible ordeal. I am mormon myself and we DO not do such a thing. It is forbidden in our religion.

I hope that these children will not go back or go through again.

jillio · 04-21-2008, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss-Delectable

Wow, that's great about the center. Why on the earth have not they created more of those center around America, or more specifically the world. Is there much demand for that kind of help?

I hope for those FLDS kids that they'll have years worth of counselling and reprogramming. They better not be dumped on people who doesn't know how to look after them. Or worse, take advantage of their naivety.

There is a huge demand for that sort of treatment. They get clients from all over the world. My friend and the origninator of the center will be traveling to Australia in a few months, as a matter of fact, to conduct seminars on theory and technique.

You are correct that it often takes years to recover from this type of indoctrination. Clients will leave and often return several years later when something in their live causes problems to resurface.

deafmummy · 04-21-2008, 02:44 PM

Just so you know... the link you added about the mormon's view on polygamy and why they practiced it, was false information. That was written by someone who was VERY anti-mormon. NOne of the temple ordinances are correct. I myself, am a member of the church, and we do not affiliate with the FLDS at all.. the FLDS practices those temple beliefs, not the other way around. Please get your information correct before assuming the LDS church does that. I was highly offended by that.. and it was not even in the least correct....

Cowpuppy · 04-21-2008, 03:05 PM

I don't care how they got the evidence. Legal or not. The fact remains that there are ex members who give testimony in public. There is no excuse for this kind of secret cult rape village. Real evidence has been systematically hidden.....marraige licenses not issued....called marraige contracts.....birth certificates are destroyed.......if a father leaves then kids given to another and papers doctored-destroyed......the 'lost boys' kiccked out for obviously being young competition drooling for the young women as is a natural thing. To kick young boys out who are unprepared for world iss an act of non-love. Yet they want to hide behind being holy and loving.
Kids scared to disagrree or protest.
Systamatic garbage. Polygamy is illegal.
Common seense should override all this hinckey garbage. kids are abused that is the bottom line. We shouldn't care about the legal aspect....kids come first....protect them.
Systematic manipulating of evidence.

jazzy · 04-21-2008, 06:44 PM

Do they have any deaf child there or any kind of physically challenge children? I wonder.

jillio · 04-21-2008, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jazzy

Do they have any deaf child there or any kind of physically challenge children? I wonder.

I know that they had some children with "special needs" according to the news reports, but the only thing identified by name was Down's Syndrome. But given the amount of intermarraige that had to be going on, one could naturally expect some birth defects.

XBGMER · 04-22-2008, 05:32 AM

Let me take few quotes from Anonymous' blog:

Quote:

..

Houston Chronicle: "The Texas Rangers told us [hoax suspect Rozita Swinton] was obsessed with the FLDS. They confiscated tons of material on the FLDS (in the search of Swinton's home). She even gave real addresses and real names of FLDS people."
Rusty: Hence, how Swinton would be able to "identify" the man who "Sarah" was allegedly married to, but didn't know that Dale Evans Barlow, the man originally pegged as the "50 year old husband", didn't actually live in Texas, but in Arizona.

Right, and now let me add something else to the equation: Notice that the middle (maiden) name for "Sarah" was "Jessop" -- "Sarah Jessop Barlow."

Well, Flora Jessop is the executive director of the anti-polygamy group quoted in that same Houston Chronicle story. And if you do a Google search on "FLDS" and "Jessop," you immediately discover that Carolyn Jessop is the author of a bestselling book, "Escape," about her life inside FLDS -- and that Carolyn Jessop appeared on "Oprah" in November 2007!

Bingo! So what must have happened is that Swinton:

Watched this "Oprah" episode in November;
Became obsessed with the FLDS cult;
Read about the compound in Texas;
Learned the name Dale Evans Barlow from reports of his prosecution;
Combined Barlow's name with "Sarah," a common female biblical name, and "Jessop," the name of the two prominent ex-FLDS women, to create a name for her fictional 16-year-old victim; and
Then did a Google search to find the phone number of a domestic-abuse hotline near the FLDS compound in Texas.

OMG! More than 400 children have been seized by the state of Texas because of an "Oprah" episode?

Also I wonder if Swinton became an Obama delegate for the same reason she became obsessed with the FLDS, namely, she saw it on "Oprah"? ..

[SOURCE]

Is that clue??

***VamPyroX*** · 04-22-2008, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafmummy

Just so you know... the link you added about the mormon's view on polygamy and why they practiced it, was false information. That was written by someone who was VERY anti-mormon. NOne of the temple ordinances are correct. I myself, am a member of the church, and we do not affiliate with the FLDS at all.. the FLDS practices those temple beliefs, not the other way around. Please get your information correct before assuming the LDS church does that. I was highly offended by that.. and it was not even in the least correct....

Which post were you responding to?

jillio · 04-22-2008, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XBGMER

Let me take few quotes from Anonymous' blog:

Is that clue??

This situation has absolutely nothing to do with the Oprah show. It doesn't matter how the information regarding the FLDS ranch came to light. What matters is the reality of what these children have been forced to endure.

sara1981 · 04-23-2008, 03:02 AM

i dont know if we have exclusives interview on Oprah show about FLDS in Texas but we have wait and see if its would be official im hope so!

Reba · 04-23-2008, 03:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

I know that they had some children with "special needs" according to the news reports, but the only thing identified by name was Down's Syndrome. But given the amount of intermarraige that had to be going on, one could naturally expect some birth defects.

Yes, I heard one of the mothers say that she was separated from her handicapped son. She didn't specify what his handicap was.

dreamchaser · 04-23-2008, 04:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pek1

This is way different than Waco and Ruby Ridge, as there are girls and boys who aren't even old enough to sprout a pubic that are told who they are to marry, with no exceptions. If I was a 13-year old girl, even as young as a toddler, I sure as heck wouldn't want some smelly old man to enter me and claim me as his wife (I'm male, btw). Even if a woman forced it upon a boy, no way!

I agree the children need to be protected. It is still scary to think that you can't chose your own religion without being raided, like at Waco, but what do you do to protect these kids without stompin on the rights of a church? It is a delimna for sure. Scary and sad that our world is like that and the innocent get hurt.
Jesus is coming, and I am sad that he will return this garbage that we have done to our world. (love your logo) Jeanie.. still chasin the dream of a better tomorrow for all!

Dixie · 04-24-2008, 09:43 PM

The rights of a church stop when the church starts abusing children and marrying minors to middle aged men.

Byrdie714 · 04-24-2008, 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dixie

The rights of a church stop when the church starts abusing children and marrying minors to middle aged men.

Amen.

sara1981 · 04-24-2008, 11:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dixie

The rights of a church stop when the church starts abusing children and marrying minors to middle aged men.

i agree!

LuciaDisturbed · 04-25-2008, 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dixie

The rights of a church stop when the church starts abusing children and marrying minors to middle aged men.

I absolutely agree!

jillio · 04-25-2008, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LuciaDisturbed

I absolutely agree!

Another one who agrees. This is not about freedom of religion. It is about the violation of civil law.

***VamPyroX*** · 04-25-2008, 02:10 PM

The DNA test could reveal more secrets...

FOXNews.com - How DNA Could Reveal Relationships of Texas Sect - Science News | Science & Technology | Technology News

jillio · 04-25-2008, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VamPyroX

The DNA test could reveal more secrets...

FOXNews.com - How DNA Could Reveal Relationships of Texas Sect - Science News | Science & Technology | Technology News

I'm sure the DNA tests will reveal much information about what really goes on in the compound as far as sexual relationships and the parentage of children is concerned. I fear that much of what is revealed will be just as shocking as some of the things that have already come to light.

***VamPyroX*** · 04-25-2008, 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

I'm sure the DNA tests will reveal much information about what really goes on in the compound as far as sexual relationships and the parentage of children is concerned. I fear that much of what is revealed will be just as shocking as some of the things that have already come to light.

It's a good thing this was done. It would certainly make things a lot easier in court.

That's one important thing when it comes to "search warrants".

One charge cannot be made unless it is related to another charge.

If the police had a warrant to search your house for stolen 32" televisions and they found a bag of weed in your kitchen drawer, they can't add charges for possession of marijuana because it was in a place that you would NOT find a television. Therefore, the search was "unreasonable".

At first, they FLDS issue started with abuse. Charges of incest, statutory rape, etc couldn't be immediately brought to attention since it's not directly related to abuse. Now, everything is there in the DNA tests. It cannot be overlooked. So, if they do find evidence that some women were minors when they became pregnant, then charges of statutory rape could be brought forward... and evidence that they came from incest, then those charges can be brought forward as well.

jillio · 04-25-2008, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VamPyroX

It's a good thing this was done. It would certainly make things a lot easier in court.

That's one important thing when it comes to "search warrants".

One charge cannot be made unless it is related to another charge.

If the police had a warrant to search your house for stolen 32" televisions and they found a bag of weed in your kitchen drawer, they can't add charges for possession of marijuana because it was in a place that you would NOT find a television. Therefore, the search was "unreasonable".

At first, they FLDS issue started with abuse. Charges of incest, statutory rape, etc couldn't be immediately brought to attention since it's not directly related to abuse. Now, everything is there in the DNA tests. It cannot be overlooked. So, if they do find evidence that some women were minors when they became pregnant, then charges of statutory rape could be brought forward... and evidence that they came from incest, then those charges can be brought forward as well.

**nodding agreement** The DNA tests will provide the evidence needed to hold those accountable for fathering children with underage girls. It is, indeed a good thing.

Miss-Delectable · 04-26-2008, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

**nodding agreement** The DNA tests will provide the evidence needed to hold those accountable for fathering children with underage girls. It is, indeed a good thing.

Never thought about the possible implications that'll come out through the DNA tests.

Would be very interesting to see what happens. Maybe many of those girls will be empowered and come forward once they feel that the outsiders will believe them and help them.

We'll know more next month or so, I expect.

jillio · 04-26-2008, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss-Delectable

Never thought about the possible implications that'll come out through the DNA tests.

Would be very interesting to see what happens. Maybe many of those girls will be empowered and come forward once they feel that the outsiders will believe them and help them.

We'll know more next month or so, I expect.

Oh, yes. Once they realize that they can trust others to help them, they will be empowered. I'm certain that many are unhappy with the situation they were forced to live in, but have been taught that this was the right way. They did not realize that there was any other way to live. It is a good thing that they are being shown that what they were forced to endure was not only wrong, but illegal.

Reba · 04-28-2008, 09:39 PM

Update:

"Officials: 31 of 53 Teen Girls Taken From Polygamist Sect Have Been Pregnant"

FOXNews.com - Officials: 31 of 53 Teen Girls Taken From Polygamist Sect Have Been Pregnant - Local News | News Articles | National News | US News

jillio · 04-28-2008, 10:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

Update:

"Officials: 31 of 53 Teen Girls Taken From Polygamist Sect Have Been Pregnant"

FOXNews.com - Officials: 31 of 53 Teen Girls Taken From Polygamist Sect Have Been Pregnant - Local News | News Articles | National News | US News

Thanks for the update, Reba. I bet if they included in that number, all of the girls that have been sexually active with a "spiritual husband", but had not yet become pregnant, the numbers would be closer to 100%.

Reba · 04-28-2008, 10:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

Thanks for the update, Reba. I bet if they included in that number, all of the girls that have been sexually active with a "spiritual husband", but had not yet become pregnant, the numbers would be closer to 100%.

Good point.

Cowpuppy · 04-30-2008, 11:18 PM

What h appens when people blindly follow a church doctrine. Boys removed ...hence the girls crave affection from only existing males......and feel 'right' about it....cuz they have been told it is 'right' in thier church's view. In isolation they are brain washed....only belifs they know.
Systematic rape......with blindly following religion as the culprit. Even the mothers protect the rapers....cuz they blindly follow religion.

Reba · 05-01-2008, 11:14 AM

Any religion that teaches its followers to lie and be deceptive is bad news. If members of a religion believe that their doctrines and behaviors are righteous, then they should be glad to share them with other people, and be very open about their beliefs and practices. Any time a group is secretive, then something is wrong.

04-21-2008, 06:44 PM	#37 (permalink)
jazzy Registered User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: High desert in Calif Posts: 3,599	Do they have any deaf child there or any kind of physically challenge children? I wonder. __________________

04-23-2008, 03:02 AM	#42 (permalink)
sara1981 Pandy the Beagle Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: North Little Rock,Ar Posts: 4,820	i dont know if we have exclusives interview on Oprah show about FLDS in Texas but we have wait and see if its would be official im hope so! __________________ WWE Dave Batista

04-24-2008, 09:43 PM	#45 (permalink)
Dixie Biggest Wimp of AllDeaf Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Arkansas Posts: 5,942	The rights of a church stop when the church starts abusing children and marrying minors to middle aged men. __________________ Visit my Deaf Blog Signature banner created by me, please do not steal!

04-25-2008, 02:10 PM	#50 (permalink)
*VamPyroX* bloody phreak from hell Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Hell Posts: 31,457	The DNA test could reveal more secrets... FOXNews.com - How DNA Could Reveal Relationships of Texas Sect - Science News \| Science & Technology \| Technology News __________________ Check out my city... CLICK HERE! (If you already visited yesterday, visit again today!)

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04-21-2008, 10:34 AM	#33 (permalink)
Chrysanthe Registered User Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 544	When we learned about this incident, I was nauseated how these people are allowing these children to go through horrible ordeal. I am mormon myself and we DO not do such a thing. It is forbidden in our religion. I hope that these children will not go back or go through again.

04-21-2008, 02:44 PM	#35 (permalink)
deafmummy Registered User Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 3 Blog Entries: 1	Just so you know... the link you added about the mormon's view on polygamy and why they practiced it, was false information. That was written by someone who was VERY anti-mormon. NOne of the temple ordinances are correct. I myself, am a member of the church, and we do not affiliate with the FLDS at all.. the FLDS practices those temple beliefs, not the other way around. Please get your information correct before assuming the LDS church does that. I was highly offended by that.. and it was not even in the least correct....

04-21-2008, 03:05 PM	#36 (permalink)
Cowpuppy Registered User Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: On The Road Again Posts: 616	I don't care how they got the evidence. Legal or not. The fact remains that there are ex members who give testimony in public. There is no excuse for this kind of secret cult rape village. Real evidence has been systematically hidden.....marraige licenses not issued....called marraige contracts.....birth certificates are destroyed.......if a father leaves then kids given to another and papers doctored-destroyed......the 'lost boys' kiccked out for obviously being young competition drooling for the young women as is a natural thing. To kick young boys out who are unprepared for world iss an act of non-love. Yet they want to hide behind being holy and loving. Kids scared to disagrree or protest. Systamatic garbage. Polygamy is illegal. Common seense should override all this hinckey garbage. kids are abused that is the bottom line. We shouldn't care about the legal aspect....kids come first....protect them. Systematic manipulating of evidence.

04-28-2008, 09:39 PM	#56 (permalink)
Reba Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 20,786	Update: "Officials: 31 of 53 Teen Girls Taken From Polygamist Sect Have Been Pregnant" FOXNews.com - Officials: 31 of 53 Teen Girls Taken From Polygamist Sect Have Been Pregnant - Local News \| News Articles \| National News \| US News

04-30-2008, 11:18 PM	#59 (permalink)
Cowpuppy Registered User Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: On The Road Again Posts: 616	What h appens when people blindly follow a church doctrine. Boys removed ...hence the girls crave affection from only existing males......and feel 'right' about it....cuz they have been told it is 'right' in thier church's view. In isolation they are brain washed....only belifs they know. Systematic rape......with blindly following religion as the culprit. Even the mothers protect the rapers....cuz they blindly follow religion.

05-01-2008, 11:14 AM	#60 (permalink)
Reba Premium Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 20,786	Any religion that teaches its followers to lie and be deceptive is bad news. If members of a religion believe that their doctrines and behaviors are righteous, then they should be glad to share them with other people, and be very open about their beliefs and practices. Any time a group is secretive, then something is wrong.