Hillary for President! Vote? - Page 5

Liebling:-))) · 11-08-2007, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

That you haven't been following the news? That's easy. The statements that you post prove that.

Is it fact?

Reba · 11-08-2007, 09:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liebling:-)))

Again, prove?

The Clintons never denied her allegations against them, nor have they sued for slander or libel because they don't want an investigation. The Clintons are afraid the truth will come out in an investigation.

Reba · 11-08-2007, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liebling:-)))

Is it fact?

You should at least be aware of what's happening before you give an opinion on the events. That's called informed decision making.

Liebling:-))) · 11-08-2007, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

When was she elected President? Did I miss something? Or do you mean when she shared the presidency with Bill?

Where have I say that she was elected President? I said that I beleive which mean is my opinion/suggestion that she could be a good president.

Don't you know that Hillary was a first lady at her husband's president time? Do you think married couple never share their discussion about work issues, etc?

Reba · 11-08-2007, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liebling:-)))

Why ?

As far as I know she support health care system for American people and including children which is great because million Americans have no health insurances.

What exactly did Hillary do to support children and American health care?

Liebling:-))) · 11-08-2007, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

What exactly did Hillary do to support children and American health care?

Hillary Rodham Clinton, Senator for New York: Senator Clinton Calls on President to Sign Children's Health Insurance Bill into Law

Reba · 11-08-2007, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liebling:-)))

Where have I say that she was elected President?

Right here: "That's why I beleive she is a great president."

Quote:

Don't you know that Hillary was a first lady at her husband's president time? Do you think married couple never share their discussion about work issues, etc?

Discuss? Yes. Make decisions for the President? No. The people elected Bill, not Hillary.

Liebling:-))) · 11-08-2007, 09:29 AM

[QUOTE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

Right here: "That's why I beleive she is a great president."

Are you pick on my typos grammar to misinterpret my post?

Quote:

Discuss? Yes. Make decisions for the President? No. The people elected Bill, not Hillary.

Yes, that's right but every married couple do like that something like that suggestion, etc. It's up to Bill either he agree with Hillary's suggestion or not.

Liebling:-))) · 11-08-2007, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

The Clintons never denied her allegations against them, nor have they sued for slander or libel because they don't want an investigation. The Clintons are afraid the truth will come out in an investigation.

Again,

http://www.alldeaf.com/866822-post109.html

Reba · 11-08-2007, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liebling:-)))

Hillary Rodham Clinton, Senator for New York: Senator Clinton Calls on President to Sign Children's Health Insurance Bill into Law

. . . and that bill was vetoed because:

Quote:

...I just vetoed a bill today, and I want to explain to you why. It's called S-CHIP -- Children's Health Insurance Policy. First of all, the intent of the S-CHIP legislation passed previous to my administration is to help poor children's families buy the children health care, or get them on health care. That's what it is intended to do. Poor children in America are covered by what's called Medicaid. We spend about -- this year -- about $35.5 billion on poor children's health insurance. So the first point I want to make to you is, a lot of your money is being spent to make sure poor children get help, medical help.

In other words, when they say, well, poor children aren't being covered in America, if that's what you're hearing on your TV screens, I'm telling you there's $35.5 billion worth of reasons not to believe that. And by the way, that Medicaid expenditures only accounts for children of the poor, it doesn't account for the mothers and fathers. So a lot of your money does go to help poor families with health insurance.

The S-CHIP program was supposed to help those poor families, the children of poor families have the ability to get health insurance for their children. I strongly support the program. I like the idea of helping those who are poor be able to get health coverage for their children. I supported it as governor, and I support it as President of the United States.

As a matter of fact, my budget -- the budget request I put in said, let's increase the spending to make sure that the program does what it's supposed to do: sign up poor children for S-CHIP. The problem is, is that the current program -- and by the way, there's about half a million children who are eligible who aren't signed up. So I said, why don't we focus on the poor children rather than expand the program beyond its initial intent.

I want to tell you a startling statistic, that based on their own states' projections -- in other words, this isn't a federal projection, it's the states saying this is what's happening -- states like New Jersey, Michigan, Minnesota, Rhode Island, Illinois and New Mexico spend more money on adults in the S-CHIP program than they do on children. In other words, the initial intent of the program is not being recognized, is not being met.

It is estimated by -- here's the thing, just so you know, this program expands coverage, federal coverage up to families earning $83,000 a year. That doesn't sound poor to me. The intent of the program was to focus on poor children, not adults or families earning up to $83,000 a year. It is estimated that if this program were to become law, one out of every three person that would subscribe to the new expanded S-CHIP would leave private insurance.

The policies of the government ought to be, help poor children and to focus on poor children. And the policies of the government ought to be, help people find private insurance, not federal coverage. And that's where the philosophical divide comes in. I happen to believe that what you're seeing when you expand eligibility for federal programs is the desire by some in Washington, D.C. to federalize health care. I don't think that's good for the country. I believe in private medicine. I believe in helping poor people -- which was the intent of S-CHIP, now being expanded beyond its initial intent. I also believe that the federal government should make it easier for people to afford private insurance. I don't want the federal government making decisions for doctors and customers.

That's why I believe strongly in health savings accounts or association health plans to help small business owners better afford insurance for their workers. That's why I believe we ought to change the federal tax code. You're disadvantaged if you work for a small business and/or an individual trying to buy insurance in the marketplace -- disadvantaged relative to somebody working for a large company. If you work for a large company, you get your health insurance after tax. If you buy insurance you have to pay -- no, you buy your insurance after taxes as an individual; you get your insurance pre-tax when you're working for a large corporation. You're at a disadvantage if you're an individual in the market place.

So I think we ought to change the tax code. I -- my view is, is that every family ought to get a $15,000 deduction off their income taxes, regardless of where they work, in order to help people better afford insurance in the marketplace.

So I want to share with you why I vetoed the bill this morning. Poor kids, first. Secondly, I believe in private medicine, not the federal government running the health care system. I do want Republicans and Democrats to come together to support a bill that focuses on the poor children. I'm more than willing to work with members of both parties from both Houses, and if they need a little more money in the bill to help us meet the objective of getting help for poor children, I'm more than willing to sit down with the leaders and find a way to do so.

So thanks for giving me a chance to discuss one of the many decisions I make as your President. Decision making requires a couple of things -- and then I'll answer some questions -- one: having a vision, having a set of beliefs, set of principles by which one makes decisions. You know, if you're constantly trying to make decisions based upon the latest poll or focus group, your decision making will be erratic. You got to have a core set of beliefs. I believe you spend your money better than the government spends. I believe that the system works better when there's more money in your hands....

President Bush Visits Lancaster Chamber of Commerce and Industry, Discusses S-CHIP

President Bush supports a program that will take care of the health needs of poor children. He wants all the poor children to enroll. He does not want the program expanded to non-poor children because then there wouldn't be enough coverage for the actually poor children.

Reba · 11-08-2007, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liebling:-)))

Are you pick on my typos grammar to misinterpret my post?

There were no typos in that statement. If anything, maybe a Freudian slip.

Reba · 11-08-2007, 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liebling:-)))

Again,
http://www.alldeaf.com/866822-post109.html

Huh? That post has nothing to do with Willey's accusations.

BTW, there is no statute of limitations on murder.

fredfam1 · 11-08-2007, 10:42 AM

which is great because million Americans have no health insurances.

You are a good respectful poster. So I will answer my belief.
A national health care system would be a disaster for this
country. I have talked personally with people who come
from other countries with these types of systems. There
is never enough money to cover the cost of such a system
no matter how much the people are taxed. They say that
the waiting line for emergency services and basic services
can be from months to even years. They have told me that
members of their families have died from waiting for appointments.
They have said that what we hear on the news about how
good the system is, is not true. I have talked to people from
Romania, Germany, many places in Europe. They all want
to come here for treatment.

If people get free health care, it will not be long befor that
health care will be rationed. I have a family of 8. I do not
have health care insurance. Oregon has an emergency plan
for children and if I need it I will use it. However, I have
chosen instead to care for my own family, to study basic
emergency care, (many free classes on cpr, etc) nutrition,
herbal remedies and natural alternatives. If they need a
check up I save up the money for it. I recently had to take
my 7 year old to the emergency room. The bill was $300. They
will take $50 per month payments. That is way better than me
paying over $400 per month for insurance that doesn't cover
very much. Our country already has systems in place to help
people in emergency situations. If I didn't have free emergency
help for my husband and myself because we are veterans then
I would pay a small premium for catastrophic health insurance.
There are always other methods to take care of oneself and ones
family. We should not burden our already overtaxed working class
with more taxes to cover health care. Our government has already
proven it can not be trusted to manage these programs. Look
at social security.

Besides all that. Hillary can not be trusted. If you really want to
know what she is like read a book by Gary Aldrich called Unlimited
Access. It will make your hair stand on end. She would make a
horrible President and she has no concern for people who are
not in positions of power.

In addition I went to one of her speeches here because my sister-in-law
was one of the interpreters for the Deaf at that function. She said that
members of Hillarys team practically had to drag her over to thank the
interpreters, and that Hillary was angry about it. (and my sisinlaw likes
Hillary)

Hillary is shrewed, intelligent and power hungry. The sad part is I am
living in a time when I will be allowed to vote for a female president and
the choice I have is her. I will not be part of placing a person who is
dishonest, tyrancal, and power hungryin office. No matter what her politics are.

Barbaro · 11-08-2007, 11:14 AM

Revenue provisions under S-CHIPS come from raising taxes on cigarettes is flawed. It needs to have additional smokers along with current smokers to fund this bill. If they continue to quit smoking at the current rate, funding will be short. Who will pay for it then? Another tax, of course. Another flaw in this bill. S-CHIPS also applies for all illegals as well. Another flaw in this bill. If families make $83,000 can afford insurance don't need S-CHIPS. Another flaw in this bill. What a waste of money. If people cannot afford to have children, they should be thinking about practicing abstinence and/or using condoms in the first place. If it passes, it would take away their choices, accountabilities and self-sufficiency, then they would have no knowledge of what's it is like to make choices, have accountability and self-sufficiency. People need to stop being materialists. The bipatrasian bill needs to be scrutinized and revised.

Liebling:-))) · 11-08-2007, 04:29 PM

[QUOTE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by fredfam1

which is great because million Americans have no health insurances.

Yes, this is a fact... That´s why Hillary support healthcare to help million Americans.

Quote:

A national health care system would be a disaster for this
country. I have talked personally with people who come
from other countries with these types of systems. There
is never enough money to cover the cost of such a system
no matter how much the people are taxed. They say that
the waiting line for emergency services and basic services
can be from months to even years. They have told me that
members of their families have died from waiting for appointments.
They have said that what we hear on the news about how
good the system is, is not true. I have talked to people from
Romania, Germany, many places in Europe. They all want
to come here for treatment.

wow, you made a misleading information here. I don´t know where you or your people get it from.

Germany? waiting list?

I live here in Germany and know about health system. I guess you confused Germany with UK health system.

I gave information about German health system out in several threads in the past because the people misunderstand about EU social system. We pay social insurances system which mean is healthcare, nursing care, pension and unemployment, not tax system.

Can you provide us the link to support your claim that Germans died from waiting list for appointments because I never heard about this but UK health system? Germans are smart people and would sue doctors for keep them long waiting to make a lot of money. We get treatment as soon as they found out something wrong with us instead of keep us long waiting. I don´t know much about Romania health system.

No, it´s not true that Western Europeans went to America for treatment because they do not need since they have health system in their countries but the people (illegal immigirants) from some poor EU countries went America for free treatment because Western EU countries doesn´t give them free treatment. EU social health system do not give illegal immigrants for treatment unless they are legal imgriation and citizions.

Quote:

If people get free health care, it will not be long befor that
health care will be rationed. I have a family of 8. I do not
have health care insurance. Oregon has an emergency plan
for children and if I need it I will use it. However, I have
chosen instead to care for my own family, to study basic
emergency care, (many free classes on cpr, etc) nutrition,
herbal remedies and natural alternatives. If they need a
check up I save up the money for it. I recently had to take
my 7 year old to the emergency room. The bill was $300. They
will take $50 per month payments. That is way better than me
paying over $400 per month for insurance that doesn't cover
very much. Our country already has systems in place to help
people in emergency situations. If I didn't have free emergency
help for my husband and myself because we are veterans then
I would pay a small premium for catastrophic health insurance.
There are always other methods to take care of oneself and ones
family. We should not burden our already overtaxed working class
with more taxes to cover health care. Our government has already
proven it can not be trusted to manage these programs. Look
at social security.

Yes, we know that US health system is poor, that´s why Hillary want to help million Americans to make their life easy. I know that health insurance in America is expensive than EU countries. I get everything what I need including spa resort every 3 to 4 years... therapies, counesllors, specialists, doctors, etc... healthcare pays... except beauty comestic system.

Quote:

Besides all that. Hillary can not be trusted. If you really want to
know what she is like read a book by Gary Aldrich called Unlimited
Access. It will make your hair stand on end. She would make a
horrible President and she has no concern for people who are
not in positions of power.

In addition I went to one of her speeches here because my sister-in-law
was one of the interpreters for the Deaf at that function. She said that
members of Hillarys team practically had to drag her over to thank the
interpreters, and that Hillary was angry about it. (and my sisinlaw likes
Hillary)

Hillary is shrewed, intelligent and power hungry. The sad part is I am
living in a time when I will be allowed to vote for a female president and
the choice I have is her. I will not be part of placing a person who is
dishonest, tyrancal, and power hungryin office. No matter what her politics are.

Sorry, I have to disagree with your negative over Hillary but I has to respect your choice. I am not here to influence your decision. Accord your post, that you paid $300 for take your daughter to emergency room... Hillary will make sure that you won´t pay other $300.00 or more for take your daughter to emergency room for next time... At German health system, we don´t pay like that... I only paid €10 at quarterly for visit emergencies and doctor appointments, no matter how often I visit in quarterly and pay medicine, cream, etc between €5 and €10 - depend the prices of medicines... Healthcare pay around 90% of worth medicines, cream. Rest, we paid €5 to €10.

Next time, please search correct information and make question instead of make a false assumption.

Maria · 11-08-2007, 06:43 PM

No, she will not get my vote. She will probably give the children MORE rights and give them what they WANT than parents. If, kids do not like somethin' and they want to sue their parents, Hillary will give them their rights to sue. Divorce their parents, sure Hillary will give them that kind of power, too. I mean, it could be anythin'.

Reba · 11-08-2007, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liebling:-)))

... At German health system, we don´t pay like that... I only paid €10 at quarterly for visit emergencies and doctor appointments, no matter how often I visit in quarterly and pay medicine, cream, etc between €5 and €10 - depend the prices of medicines... Healthcare pay around 90% of worth medicines, cream. Rest, we paid €5 to €10.

So who is actually paying for your medical care?

Tousi · 11-08-2007, 08:46 PM

Who said vote for Hillary?

fredfam1 · 11-08-2007, 10:39 PM

Sorry, I have to disagree with your negative over Hillary but I has to respect your choice. I am not here to influence your decision. Accord your post, that you paid $300 for take your daughter to emergency room... Hillary will make sure that you won´t pay other $300.00 or more for take your daughter to emergency room for next time... At German health system, we don´t pay like that... I only paid €10 at quarterly for visit emergencies and doctor appointments, no matter how often I visit in quarterly and pay medicine, cream, etc between €5 and €10 - depend the prices of medicines... Healthcare pay around 90% of worth medicines, cream. Rest, we paid €5 to €10.

Next time, please search correct information and make question instead of make a false assumption.

The people I have personally spoken to lived here leagelly from Germany, Romania, and Mexico. Well another European country but I cant remember
where. Anyway we can forget about Mexico in this debat. They don't
do much for their people at all. The one good thing I did hear about
Romanian surgons was they are highly skilled, but it took my friend
Carmen 6 months to get a hysterectomy because of a waiting list.
Now I admit to having used old research, and when I just did a search,
(Maybe you can help me) I googled, "Health Care Access Germany" and
other variations of this. What comes up on my screen is UK, Canada, China
(none of which I typed in!) except this one article on health care access for
the poor Germans.

t. Ignatius Medical Clinic: Making Health Care Affordable for the Poor
Mike Banos

Mike Banos is a free-lance journalist who contributes an opinion column "Hammer and Anvil" to the Mindanao Gold Star Daily newspaper Mondays and Fridays. He is a member of the Cagayan de Oro Press Club, Inc. Board of Directors and has been a journalist for over 20 years in the cities of Zamboanga and Cagayan de Oro, Philippines. He is the content provider for Kagay-an.com, Online News from Cagayan de Oro.

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Mike Banos
November 8, 2007

Cagayan de Oro City – While serving the rural barangays for the City Health Department as Medical Officer in the early nineties, Dr. Meneleo "Loloi" R. Navarro was struck by the extreme poverty of most people in the area who couldn't even afford basic medical care.

"When we gave them a prescription for their ailments they would just look at us and ask 'What shall we do with this?' recalls Dr. Navarro. "We realized that people who didn't even earn enough to eat couldn't possible have any money to buy medicines when they got sick."

Together with his schoolmates from the Xavier University-Ateneo de Cagayan High School: Drs. Erickson San Juan, Raoul dela Serna, Aaron Oliveros and Victor Orencia, Dr. Navarro established the St. Ignatius Medical Clinic for the poor at a makeshift clinic below a private residence at 8th St., Nazareth in 1991.

When they started, the group only charged a medical consultation fee of P25 with medicines provided free of charge through the Committee of German Doctors under Peter Metzger, medical director.

"We want to make it affordable so the price does not become a barrier to consultation," Dr. dela Serna said. "However, although we could have provided our services for free, we made it a point to charge a minimum consultation fee because we wanted people to value their own health by giving it the dignity it deserves. Of course in extreme cases, we even waived that for patients who couldn't even afford that minimal amount."

Initially, even Mr. Metzger himself was skeptical of the project, but when he saw for himself the doctors dedication and the number of patients flocking to the clinic, he not only provided free medicines but even gave Dr. Navarro free use of his 4X4 vehicle when the latter went up to the rural areas to serve patients who couldn't afford the fare to go downtown.

Since they only had a few patients at the start, they only had Dr. de la Serna as full time resident doctor while the rest reported part-time depending on the need for their services.

In no time at all, the little clinic was serving 150-200 patients a day.

However, even at that early stage, the founders already realized they had to break free of their dependence on the German Doctors if they wanted their clinic to sustain itself in the long run. In 1993, the group registered the St. Ignatius Health Foundation, Inc. (SIHFI) with the Securities and Exchange Commission as a non-stock, non-profit foundation.

From the start, the group only sourced its funds from its patients, and dug into personal pockets when funds ran short, which was often. Furniture and appliances for the clinic were personal items made available for its use by the founders.

Their efforts did not go unnoticed. During its March 2002 commencement exercises, Xavier University-Ateneo de Cagayan (XU-AdC) cited SIHFI as its first awardee for the Fr. William Masterson Award for Community Service. Barely a year later, the Committee of German Doctors stopped providing the clinic with free medicines. What looked at first to be the end of the project in fact turned out to be a blessing in disguise.

By accident (or Divine Intervention, depending on how you see it), Dr. Navarro found the present site of the clinic at the Pelaez Sports Center. The 120 sq.m. space provided space for a receiving area, and two consultation rooms for pediatrics and surgery.

Again, Divine Intervention came along and made a nearby space available for the St. Ignatius Medical Clinic Pharmacy which was established in March 8, 2006 to sell essential medicines to indigent patients at a price they could afford. Evie Taylor, its cashier, retired from her job in Australia and came home to head the new enterprise.

"We surveyed the local costs of medicines and we were able to lower the prices of most medicines by making just enough margin to cover operations and overhead," Dr. Navarro said. "We were assisted in our endeavor by the BIR which gave us a Certificate of Tax Exemption. Whatever income the pharmacy generated was plowed back to finance the medical clinic and the Maternal and Child Care (Birthing Home) which began operations in March 18, 2007."

"We want to give the best service we can at least cost to the patient," Dr. dela Serna said.

But the situation then was far from ideal.

"We thought the health woes of our patients were properly addressed with the cheap medicines offered by our pharmacy and the token P80 consultation fee," Dr. Navarro said. "However, we realized that diagnostic exams needed to confirm our physical diagnosis were still beyond the reach of our patients."

This posed a big problem for the trustees because of the big amount of money need to run a clinical laboratory. Armed only with hope and trust that anything good done will bring graces from above, the trustees persuaded their creditors to grant them liberal payment schemes for expensive laboratory equipment.

On May 18, 2007, the St. Ignatius Diagnostic Center became operational, still situated in the Pelaez Sport Center. A spot sampling of their prices reveals the clinic remains true to its word to make health care affordable for the poor. Urinalysis and fecalysis only cost P30.00, even cheaper than some government hospitals. Package rates for CBC and Urinalysis or CBC/fecalysis are also available for only P100.00

What does the future hold for the intrepid band of doctors who dared buck the trend of their fellow medical practitioners seeking greener pastures abroad or charging expensive rates for their services?

"We named our clinic after St. Ignatius, the patron saint of the Ateneo, where we all come from," Dr. Navarro. "We are men and women for others who subscribe to the Jesuit creed "Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam" (For the Greater Glory of God). This is our past, our present and hopefully with God's grace, it would also be our future."

fredfam1 · 11-08-2007, 10:43 PM

I couldn't get the rest of this on the previous post.
Anyway is this the norm for your part of Germany?
Are the wealthy getting access but not the poor?
And please explain again how Germany pays for health
care if not with taxes? Our government wants to
raise taxes to cover health care costs. We are already
at around the 50% tile when you add up Federal, State,
and hidden taxes.

I did get the impression from other news articles that
Germany is doing beter than other nations with its program
so I am very ineterested in how exactly its paid for.
Thanks.

fredfam1 · 11-08-2007, 10:49 PM

Oh and I will give credit where credit is due. European countries, (I am told so please correct if I am wrong) give access to hyperbaric chamber treatments. And promote alternative therapies. Does your system pay for herbs and other treatments like that?

Liebling:-))) · 11-09-2007, 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

So who is actually paying for your medical care?

My health insurance.

Liebling:-))) · 11-09-2007, 12:46 AM

fredfam1,

I will answer your post when I am in the office. I have to leave here to prepare the breakfast for my family before I go to work. Of course you will get link from me.

Liebling:-))) · 11-09-2007, 02:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba
So who is actually paying for your medical care?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liebling:-)))

My health insurance.

I forget to add bit more...

The employers pay 50% of tax and social insurances for their employees accord German law.

About health insurance:

I can compare % of health insurance companies with good advantages before join them.

Liebling:-))) · 11-09-2007, 03:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fredfam1

Oh and I will give credit where credit is due. European countries, (I am told so please correct if I am wrong) give access to hyperbaric chamber treatments. And promote alternative therapies. Does your system pay for herbs and other treatments like that?

About hyperbaric chamber treatments - I use those word "Hyperbaric Oxygen Therapy"

Yes, German public health insurance covers the cost of those treats in most cases.

Example: tinnitus, hearing loss, cancer, head injury, trauma, stroke, etc. My MIL received Hyperbaric Oxygen Therapy after finish with chemo therapy to cure her breast cancer at years ago. My son had Hyperbaric Oxygen therapy for cure his head injury after head surgery due severe bicycle accident at 2 years ago.

In the moment yes and no, Public health insurance system pay PART of herbs medical treatments, like homeopathy and acupuncture treatments etc. After years protest, they accept part herbs medical treatments in public insurance system time to time at last. (Not 100% yet). We are fighting to have fully herbs treatments in public health insurance... At the moment you have to insure Private Health insurance if you support herbs treatment fully. We have many private doctors for herbs, homeopathy & acupuncture treatments here in Germany. We called them "herbal or natural doctors", not family doctor or specialists because they consider herbal medicines only. My family doctor experienced with herbal medicines, etc... She don't write medicial for us but cream, herbal drops (where public health insurance cover the cost) and advise us to drink herbal teas. We drink herb teas a lot to cure our flu, cold, etc.

Accord your post #139 is a misleading information.

You said that you met Germans personally. I guess it could be that ex-communists (former Eastern Germans) who live in East German before the Berlin Wall pulled down in 1990. We know that they have poor health system in East Germany (communist area), not West Germany.

Tousi · 11-09-2007, 04:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liebling:-)))

I forget to add bit more...

The employers pay 50% of tax and social insurances for their employees accord German law.

About health insurance:

I can compare % of health insurance companies with good advantages before join them.

Who pays for the other 50%?

Liebling:-))) · 11-09-2007, 04:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fredfam1

I couldn't get the rest of this on the previous post.
Anyway is this the norm for your part of Germany?
Are the wealthy getting access but not the poor?
And please explain again how Germany pays for health
care if not with taxes? Our government wants to
raise taxes to cover health care costs. We are already
at around the 50% tile when you add up Federal, State,
and hidden taxes.

I did get the impression from other news articles that
Germany is doing beter than other nations with its program
so I am very ineterested in how exactly its paid for.
Thanks.

German health care system.

Germany Guide: Introduction, The German health care system The German health care system has the reputation of.
then you will see more links in those link.

German Health System - Health Care Provider Germany

We started to pay 10 euros per quarter and between 5 and 10 euros for medicines from doctor in 2004. No more cover the cost for glasses for adults from 18 years old. Dental is including in public health insurance, but very low % than 50% for teeth crown and no more % for teeth implant but just check-up, clean, repair, filling, operation to correct teeth, etc. If you want to have teeth implant and crown to 100% then insure private health insurance.

Your tax in Germany, Money, Germany, Expatica

Taxation in Germany: Information and Much More from Answers.com

How To Germany - German Taxes

You can look at German Tax System at some links in my thread and social insurance system has nothing do with tax system.

Social system mean is insurances, we work and pay insurances every monthly from wage slip.

Health insurance
pension insurance
Unemployment insursance
Nursing insurance

German Tax system, we work and pay tax every monthly.

Gross tax to Government
solidarity tax to Government
Church tax to church officer

And more taxes issues in my thread...

http://www.alldeaf.com/general-chat/...ies-world.html

And illegal immigrants - no wonder why they went to America.
Illegal Immigrants in Germany : No Work, School or Medical Care - JOURNAL CHRETIEN

I hope all answer, I give to your question. Any questions?

Liebling:-))) · 11-09-2007, 04:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tousi

Who pays for the other 50%?

I as an employee.

Liebling:-))) · 11-09-2007, 06:12 AM

Can we discuss in my few days old thread to aviod

here?

http://www.alldeaf.com/general-chat/...nsurances.html

You can paste our posts over my thread to discuss about insurances.

Reba · 11-09-2007, 07:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Liebling:-)))

My health insurance.

Who pays for the health insurance?

11-08-2007, 10:42 AM	#133 (permalink)
fredfam1 Cathe Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Oregon Posts: 1,024	all kidding set aside which is great because million Americans have no health insurances. You are a good respectful poster. So I will answer my belief. A national health care system would be a disaster for this country. I have talked personally with people who come from other countries with these types of systems. There is never enough money to cover the cost of such a system no matter how much the people are taxed. They say that the waiting line for emergency services and basic services can be from months to even years. They have told me that members of their families have died from waiting for appointments. They have said that what we hear on the news about how good the system is, is not true. I have talked to people from Romania, Germany, many places in Europe. They all want to come here for treatment. If people get free health care, it will not be long befor that health care will be rationed. I have a family of 8. I do not have health care insurance. Oregon has an emergency plan for children and if I need it I will use it. However, I have chosen instead to care for my own family, to study basic emergency care, (many free classes on cpr, etc) nutrition, herbal remedies and natural alternatives. If they need a check up I save up the money for it. I recently had to take my 7 year old to the emergency room. The bill was $300. They will take $50 per month payments. That is way better than me paying over $400 per month for insurance that doesn't cover very much. Our country already has systems in place to help people in emergency situations. If I didn't have free emergency help for my husband and myself because we are veterans then I would pay a small premium for catastrophic health insurance. There are always other methods to take care of oneself and ones family. We should not burden our already overtaxed working class with more taxes to cover health care. Our government has already proven it can not be trusted to manage these programs. Look at social security. Besides all that. Hillary can not be trusted. If you really want to know what she is like read a book by Gary Aldrich called Unlimited Access. It will make your hair stand on end. She would make a horrible President and she has no concern for people who are not in positions of power. In addition I went to one of her speeches here because my sister-in-law was one of the interpreters for the Deaf at that function. She said that members of Hillarys team practically had to drag her over to thank the interpreters, and that Hillary was angry about it. (and my sisinlaw likes Hillary) Hillary is shrewed, intelligent and power hungry. The sad part is I am living in a time when I will be allowed to vote for a female president and the choice I have is her. I will not be part of placing a person who is dishonest, tyrancal, and power hungryin office. No matter what her politics are.

11-08-2007, 11:14 AM	#134 (permalink)
Barbaro doomsday clock's clicking Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: dæləs Posts: 535	Revenue provisions under S-CHIPS come from raising taxes on cigarettes is flawed. It needs to have additional smokers along with current smokers to fund this bill. If they continue to quit smoking at the current rate, funding will be short. Who will pay for it then? Another tax, of course. Another flaw in this bill. S-CHIPS also applies for all illegals as well. Another flaw in this bill. If families make $83,000 can afford insurance don't need S-CHIPS. Another flaw in this bill. What a waste of money. If people cannot afford to have children, they should be thinking about practicing abstinence and/or using condoms in the first place. If it passes, it would take away their choices, accountabilities and self-sufficiency, then they would have no knowledge of what's it is like to make choices, have accountability and self-sufficiency. People need to stop being materialists. The bipatrasian bill needs to be scrutinized and revised. __________________ We know what we are but not what we may be. -Author:Shakespeare

11-09-2007, 12:46 AM	#143 (permalink)
Liebling:-))) Sussi 7.7.86 - 18.6.09 Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Germany Posts: 30,970	fredfam1, I will answer your post when I am in the office. I have to leave here to prepare the breakfast for my family before I go to work. Of course you will get link from me. __________________

11-09-2007, 06:12 AM	#149 (permalink)
Liebling:-))) Sussi 7.7.86 - 18.6.09 Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Germany Posts: 30,970	Can we discuss in my few days old thread to aviod here? http://www.alldeaf.com/general-chat/...nsurances.html You can paste our posts over my thread to discuss about insurances. __________________

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11-08-2007, 06:43 PM	#136 (permalink)
Maria Premium Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: FLORIDA Posts: 10,063	No, she will not get my vote. She will probably give the children MORE rights and give them what they WANT than parents. If, kids do not like somethin' and they want to sue their parents, Hillary will give them their rights to sue. Divorce their parents, sure Hillary will give them that kind of power, too. I mean, it could be anythin'.

11-08-2007, 08:46 PM	#138 (permalink)
Tousi Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 9,550	Who said vote for Hillary?

11-08-2007, 10:39 PM	#139 (permalink)
fredfam1 Cathe Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Oregon Posts: 1,024	Sorry, I have to disagree with your negative over Hillary but I has to respect your choice. I am not here to influence your decision. Accord your post, that you paid $300 for take your daughter to emergency room... Hillary will make sure that you won´t pay other $300.00 or more for take your daughter to emergency room for next time... At German health system, we don´t pay like that... I only paid €10 at quarterly for visit emergencies and doctor appointments, no matter how often I visit in quarterly and pay medicine, cream, etc between €5 and €10 - depend the prices of medicines... Healthcare pay around 90% of worth medicines, cream. Rest, we paid €5 to €10. Next time, please search correct information and make question instead of make a false assumption. The people I have personally spoken to lived here leagelly from Germany, Romania, and Mexico. Well another European country but I cant remember where. Anyway we can forget about Mexico in this debat. They don't do much for their people at all. The one good thing I did hear about Romanian surgons was they are highly skilled, but it took my friend Carmen 6 months to get a hysterectomy because of a waiting list. Now I admit to having used old research, and when I just did a search, (Maybe you can help me) I googled, "Health Care Access Germany" and other variations of this. What comes up on my screen is UK, Canada, China (none of which I typed in!) except this one article on health care access for the poor Germans. t. Ignatius Medical Clinic: Making Health Care Affordable for the Poor Mike Banos Mike Banos is a free-lance journalist who contributes an opinion column "Hammer and Anvil" to the Mindanao Gold Star Daily newspaper Mondays and Fridays. He is a member of the Cagayan de Oro Press Club, Inc. Board of Directors and has been a journalist for over 20 years in the cities of Zamboanga and Cagayan de Oro, Philippines. He is the content provider for Kagay-an.com, Online News from Cagayan de Oro. author's email author's web site view author's other articles Join this author's mailing list Your Name: E-mail Address: Mike Banos November 8, 2007 Cagayan de Oro City – While serving the rural barangays for the City Health Department as Medical Officer in the early nineties, Dr. Meneleo "Loloi" R. Navarro was struck by the extreme poverty of most people in the area who couldn't even afford basic medical care. "When we gave them a prescription for their ailments they would just look at us and ask 'What shall we do with this?' recalls Dr. Navarro. "We realized that people who didn't even earn enough to eat couldn't possible have any money to buy medicines when they got sick." Together with his schoolmates from the Xavier University-Ateneo de Cagayan High School: Drs. Erickson San Juan, Raoul dela Serna, Aaron Oliveros and Victor Orencia, Dr. Navarro established the St. Ignatius Medical Clinic for the poor at a makeshift clinic below a private residence at 8th St., Nazareth in 1991. When they started, the group only charged a medical consultation fee of P25 with medicines provided free of charge through the Committee of German Doctors under Peter Metzger, medical director. "We want to make it affordable so the price does not become a barrier to consultation," Dr. dela Serna said. "However, although we could have provided our services for free, we made it a point to charge a minimum consultation fee because we wanted people to value their own health by giving it the dignity it deserves. Of course in extreme cases, we even waived that for patients who couldn't even afford that minimal amount." Initially, even Mr. Metzger himself was skeptical of the project, but when he saw for himself the doctors dedication and the number of patients flocking to the clinic, he not only provided free medicines but even gave Dr. Navarro free use of his 4X4 vehicle when the latter went up to the rural areas to serve patients who couldn't afford the fare to go downtown. Since they only had a few patients at the start, they only had Dr. de la Serna as full time resident doctor while the rest reported part-time depending on the need for their services. In no time at all, the little clinic was serving 150-200 patients a day. However, even at that early stage, the founders already realized they had to break free of their dependence on the German Doctors if they wanted their clinic to sustain itself in the long run. In 1993, the group registered the St. Ignatius Health Foundation, Inc. (SIHFI) with the Securities and Exchange Commission as a non-stock, non-profit foundation. From the start, the group only sourced its funds from its patients, and dug into personal pockets when funds ran short, which was often. Furniture and appliances for the clinic were personal items made available for its use by the founders. Their efforts did not go unnoticed. During its March 2002 commencement exercises, Xavier University-Ateneo de Cagayan (XU-AdC) cited SIHFI as its first awardee for the Fr. William Masterson Award for Community Service. Barely a year later, the Committee of German Doctors stopped providing the clinic with free medicines. What looked at first to be the end of the project in fact turned out to be a blessing in disguise. By accident (or Divine Intervention, depending on how you see it), Dr. Navarro found the present site of the clinic at the Pelaez Sports Center. The 120 sq.m. space provided space for a receiving area, and two consultation rooms for pediatrics and surgery. Again, Divine Intervention came along and made a nearby space available for the St. Ignatius Medical Clinic Pharmacy which was established in March 8, 2006 to sell essential medicines to indigent patients at a price they could afford. Evie Taylor, its cashier, retired from her job in Australia and came home to head the new enterprise. "We surveyed the local costs of medicines and we were able to lower the prices of most medicines by making just enough margin to cover operations and overhead," Dr. Navarro said. "We were assisted in our endeavor by the BIR which gave us a Certificate of Tax Exemption. Whatever income the pharmacy generated was plowed back to finance the medical clinic and the Maternal and Child Care (Birthing Home) which began operations in March 18, 2007." "We want to give the best service we can at least cost to the patient," Dr. dela Serna said. But the situation then was far from ideal. "We thought the health woes of our patients were properly addressed with the cheap medicines offered by our pharmacy and the token P80 consultation fee," Dr. Navarro said. "However, we realized that diagnostic exams needed to confirm our physical diagnosis were still beyond the reach of our patients." This posed a big problem for the trustees because of the big amount of money need to run a clinical laboratory. Armed only with hope and trust that anything good done will bring graces from above, the trustees persuaded their creditors to grant them liberal payment schemes for expensive laboratory equipment. On May 18, 2007, the St. Ignatius Diagnostic Center became operational, still situated in the Pelaez Sport Center. A spot sampling of their prices reveals the clinic remains true to its word to make health care affordable for the poor. Urinalysis and fecalysis only cost P30.00, even cheaper than some government hospitals. Package rates for CBC and Urinalysis or CBC/fecalysis are also available for only P100.00 What does the future hold for the intrepid band of doctors who dared buck the trend of their fellow medical practitioners seeking greener pastures abroad or charging expensive rates for their services? "We named our clinic after St. Ignatius, the patron saint of the Ateneo, where we all come from," Dr. Navarro. "We are men and women for others who subscribe to the Jesuit creed "Ad Majorem Dei Gloriam" (For the Greater Glory of God). This is our past, our present and hopefully with God's grace, it would also be our future."

11-08-2007, 10:43 PM	#140 (permalink)
fredfam1 Cathe Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Oregon Posts: 1,024	I couldn't get the rest of this on the previous post. Anyway is this the norm for your part of Germany? Are the wealthy getting access but not the poor? And please explain again how Germany pays for health care if not with taxes? Our government wants to raise taxes to cover health care costs. We are already at around the 50% tile when you add up Federal, State, and hidden taxes. I did get the impression from other news articles that Germany is doing beter than other nations with its program so I am very ineterested in how exactly its paid for. Thanks.

11-08-2007, 10:49 PM	#141 (permalink)
fredfam1 Cathe Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Oregon Posts: 1,024	Oh and I will give credit where credit is due. European countries, (I am told so please correct if I am wrong) give access to hyperbaric chamber treatments. And promote alternative therapies. Does your system pay for herbs and other treatments like that?