Beegone - Page 2

DragonYoga · 04-18-2008, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreamchaser

Hey thanks! I am just so lucky as a beginning student get to see this process in real-time. Forgive me please if I put input where it doesn't belong, just correct me gently (my bones are brittle these days) and I will learn. Sometimes I learn best from biggest boo-boos.

Question: I understand that you want to add characters slowly, makes perfect sense. I am not sure if I understand how much info you want to convey at first introduction. I realize that characters develop and your insight into them gets deeper, but when you first introduce them, should you make it clear if they are an alien or a bear, gender and so forth, so when you refer back to them, people have some idea of what you are talking about? Is it just a style preference? If you want to build suspense, and you introduce a character that will return in later chapters, so you don't want to divuldge too much, just how much of an introduction is necessary for reader comprehension?

Introduce them with general physical descriptions and some interesting characteristics that sets them apart, the same way you'd notice if you met someone the first time. Let's take Bob/Robert for example:

No matter how much Bob slouched, he couldn't hide his nearly 7'8" frame, and he appeared taller because of his almost unnatural thinness. Naturally blonde with sun-darkened skin, he looked more like a beach bum than anything else, with ratty clothes and old flip-flips. He was standing on the boulevard facing the beach, his eyes squinted from the sun. He scanned the crowd, a certain shiftiness in his eyes, and in the way he stood.

That's an example. Just start with the basics, keep to the flow of the story, don't be too specific. You want general descriptions, the reader will fill in the rest in his/her mind.

DragonYoga · 04-18-2008, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chase

It all goes back to long-ago labeling without better scientific knowledge. Same reason American Indian is an oxymoron. Much like many think the Australian koala is a bear. It's why North American pronghorns, wapiti, and bison are wrongly called antelope, elk, and buffalo. The list goes on.

And to think I want to be a teacher! :-X I'm embarrassed to say the only one I know is bison. I never heard of the other two real names for the animals... *is embarrassed over the quality of my education*

dreamchaser · 04-19-2008, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DragonYoga

Introduce them with general physical descriptions and some interesting characteristics that sets them apart, the same way you'd notice if you met someone the first time. Let's take Bob/Robert for example:

No matter how much Bob slouched, he couldn't hide his nearly 7'8" frame, and he appeared taller because of his almost unnatural thinness. Naturally blonde with sun-darkened skin, he looked more like a beach bum than anything else, with ratty clothes and old flip-flips. He was standing on the boulevard facing the beach, his eyes squinted from the sun. He scanned the crowd, a certain shiftiness in his eyes, and in the way he stood.

That's an example. Just start with the basics, keep to the flow of the story, don't be too specific. You want general descriptions, the reader will fill in the rest in his/her mind.

Hey, just went to your site.. Cool. I just can't believe that I am in the midst of real writers, especially Deaf writers.... I'm not worthy!!! But, greatful I am.

So, in response to your response, I was wondering; would it be advantageous for the Beofewolf to be introduced and then non-chalantly (no clue how to spell that) let the reader know that he is a bear, and his counterpart would be a sow? I am just confused about this. If I introduce a character, don't I need to make my readers aware of their species,,, unless of course I were introducing someone with a secret identity, like a spy etc. But at least if you introduce a character, are you suppose to let the species be known, as in the bear? It had a name, but no identity????????? Help... I am really confused now..

Hey, one more time,, THANKS!

DragonYoga · 04-19-2008, 06:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreamchaser

Hey, just went to your site.. Cool. I just can't believe that I am in the midst of real writers, especially Deaf writers.... I'm not worthy!!! But, greatful I am.

So, in response to your response, I was wondering; would it be advantageous for the Beofewolf to be introduced and then non-chalantly (no clue how to spell that) let the reader know that he is a bear, and his counterpart would be a sow? I am just confused about this. If I introduce a character, don't I need to make my readers aware of their species,,, unless of course I were introducing someone with a secret identity, like a spy etc. But at least if you introduce a character, are you suppose to let the species be known, as in the bear? It had a name, but no identity????????? Help... I am really confused now..

Hey, one more time,, THANKS!

Using Beowulf as an example, I would say "That Beowulf, that blasted old bear" and that would establish what/who Beowulf is to the narrator AND the reader. We don't know at this point from reading the first chapter if it's advantageous for the readers to know about Beowulf now, but Chase did say he plays a bigger part in the story later. So IMO it's a good idea to give hints to the reader and then remind the reader later when the character shows up again. But be careful with this method - use it only if you really WILL use this character!!!

If the character you are introducing has a secret identity, it would depend on a need-to-know basis with the reader. Do the readers need to know this right away, or can it be revealed later? But, if you choose to reveal it now, then it has to be (IMO) one of the main characters, and it would work best if it were from his/her point of view. If you chose to reveal it later, then it would serve as a plot twist.

dreamchaser · 04-19-2008, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DragonYoga

Using Beowulf as an example, I would say "That Beowulf, that blasted old bear" and that would establish what/who Beowulf is to the narrator AND the reader. We don't know at this point from reading the first chapter if it's advantageous for the readers to know about Beowulf now, but Chase did say he plays a bigger part in the story later. So IMO it's a good idea to give hints to the reader and then remind the reader later when the character shows up again. But be careful with this method - use it only if you really WILL use this character!!!

If the character you are introducing has a secret identity, it would depend on a need-to-know basis with the reader. Do the readers need to know this right away, or can it be revealed later? But, if you choose to reveal it now, then it has to be (IMO) one of the main characters, and it would work best if it were from his/her point of view. If you chose to reveal it later, then it would serve as a plot twist.

Cooool, thanks. I have to start brainstorming about a story real soon. I don't know yet what our assignment will be for our final essay/ short story, but I will be getting my first crack at thinking in fiction and defining characters. It is exciting but scary. I have never even tried to write anything fiction, except for one short essay. Watching chase work on this chapter has already given me some inspiration, and now I am gaining some working knowledge by seeing you guys discuss characters etc. Thanks so much. J

DragonYoga · 04-19-2008, 05:06 PM

Another good site for looking at short stories & seeing what others say is at Scribophile, the social writing workshop and writer's community (I'm Phedre on there). You can read the stories and get a general idea of how to write.

You'll be fine!

dreamchaser · 04-19-2008, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DragonYoga

Another good site for looking at short stories & seeing what others say is at Scribophile, the social writing workshop and writer's community (I'm Phedre on there). You can read the stories and get a general idea of how to write.

You'll be fine!

that is so cool. thanks... TEEEHEEE, forgive me if my posts are rather iliterately writen. If I go back and edit for accuracy, I never post it. so,,, I just write like I am thinkin. I really do know better though. Thanks again!

Chase · 05-06-2008, 02:52 PM

Changes noted. Thanks so much.

Chase · 05-06-2008, 03:02 PM

Changes noted. Thanks so much.

Chase · 05-06-2008, 03:10 PM

Changes noted. Thanks so much.

dreamchaser · 05-06-2008, 03:14 PM

Congrats!!!!

Bottesini · 05-06-2008, 03:21 PM

Correcting typos my favorite pastime.

Chapter 2

1. Raccoon instead of racoon

2.Paragraph 6 should say "saw her costume" instead of "saw costume"

Chapter 3

1. Heroine's hair changed from blonde to brown.

PS I love your story and will purchase when published

Chase · 05-06-2008, 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bottesini

Correcting typos my favorite pastime.

Thanks a bunch for catching the missing "c" in raccoon and missing "her" in the sentence. Other eyes are such a great help. I edited them already.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bottesini

Chapter 3 . . . Heroine's hair changed from blonde to brown.

Not only is her hair brown when Dieter sees her, it's long instead of short, as in Erik's narrative. Careful mystery readers are supposed to remember the differences, even suppose it may be writer-error . . . until later. Again, good catch.

dreamchaser · 05-07-2008, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chase

Thanks a bunch for catching the missing "c" in raccoon and missing "her" in the sentence. Other eyes are such a great help. I edited them already.

Not only is her hair brown when Dieter sees her, it's long instead of short, as in Erik's narrative. Careful mystery readers are supposed to remember the differences, even suppose it may be writer-error . . . until later. Again, good catch.

IT is very exciting to watch this unfold.. Good luck and God speed. J

Matilda · 05-10-2008, 05:43 AM

Chase ...

Chapter One:
The word, ‘dance, danced, dances, dancer’ ... is that too many for a chapter?

Chapter Two: a much better revision of this chapter
USDA (choice) ... huh?

‘Just as crazy were sandals with heels, no socks’ (that’s a fashion no-no to wear socks with sandals) ... stockings or nylons?

Chapter Three: cannot see any mistakes there

All three chapters, excellently written

Chase · 05-13-2008, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ozzie

Chapter One: The word, ‘dance, danced, dances, dancer’ ... is that too many for a chapter?

Probably. Working on reducing "echoes." I also believe they detract.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ozzie

Chapter Two: a much better revision of this chapter
USDA (choice) ... huh? ‘Just as crazy were sandals with heels, no socks’ (that’s a fashion no-no to wear socks with sandals) ... stockings or nylons?

Many thanks for "better" comment. It's my goal. "USDA choice" is a US Department of Agriculture grade of meat, and heard in farm country as a crude remark meaning a good body. Ha ha ha, beekeepers know zilch about fashion, and no socks is crazy to him. But your comment gives me a good idea for later.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ozzie

Chapter Three: cannot see any mistakes there.

Thanks much. I always appreciate seeing mistakes, and I also need to see things that work, especially if the deaf references are convincing. Again, I can't tell you how valuable are these critiques.

04-19-2008, 05:06 PM	#36 (permalink)
DragonYoga chocolatechocolate! Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: St. Augustine, FL Posts: 154	Another good site for looking at short stories & seeing what others say is at Scribophile, the social writing workshop and writer's community (I'm Phedre on there). You can read the stories and get a general idea of how to write. You'll be fine! __________________ MMM...CHOCOLATE!!!

05-06-2008, 02:52 PM	#38 (permalink)
Chase Retired on ex-mod pension Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Albany, Oregon Posts: 2,066	Rewrite of [I]Beegone[/I] Changes noted. Thanks so much. Last edited by Chase; 05-15-2008 at 01:21 PM.

05-06-2008, 03:02 PM	#39 (permalink)
Chase Retired on ex-mod pension Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Albany, Oregon Posts: 2,066	Changes noted. Thanks so much. Last edited by Chase; 05-15-2008 at 01:22 PM.

05-06-2008, 03:10 PM	#40 (permalink)
Chase Retired on ex-mod pension Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Albany, Oregon Posts: 2,066	Changes noted. Thanks so much. Last edited by Chase; 05-15-2008 at 01:22 PM.

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05-06-2008, 03:14 PM	#41 (permalink)
dreamchaser Registered User Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 548 Blog Entries: 1	Congrats!!!!

05-06-2008, 03:21 PM	#42 (permalink)
Bottesini Defy Dragons! Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Right behind you! Posts: 2,102	Correcting typos my favorite pastime. Chapter 2 1. Raccoon instead of racoon 2.Paragraph 6 should say "saw her costume" instead of "saw costume" Chapter 3 1. Heroine's hair changed from blonde to brown. PS I love your story and will purchase when published

05-10-2008, 05:43 AM	#45 (permalink)
Matilda "Sunshine Beach, Qld" Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 1,759	Chase ... Chapter One: The word, ‘dance, danced, dances, dancer’ ... is that too many for a chapter? Chapter Two: a much better revision of this chapter USDA (choice) ... huh? ‘Just as crazy were sandals with heels, no socks’ (that’s a fashion no-no to wear socks with sandals) ... stockings or nylons? Chapter Three: cannot see any mistakes there All three chapters, excellently written