Oregon community college shooting, multiple casualties

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seb said:
They will not stop because you aren't dealing with rational sane people. If they don't go to a school to do the shooting they will go to a mall, a large company, a movie theater, etc. They are sick and should not be allowed to have guns. Take away the guns and they may still kill someone, but will use a knife or some other weapon that won't have the killing power or capacity that a gun has and they won't be taking out 10 or 20 at a clip and wounding 20 or 30 more.
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Don't forget, they STILL can get guns from street dealer, that is the meaning of black market. Many guns have been stolen, sold illegal and so on. HOW can you stop that? Gun control? My ass!

Let me tell you what I have witness, I was there the whole time when one of my old friend got so mad that a guy raped his girlfriend, he came to me and need ride. I was like ok, then go down to street and he said stay here I will be back. I watched what he did, he looked at handgun, he was ready to buy it... I had to stop him, man! I couldn't believe how EASY it was! That is where you overlooked. Glad I was able to stop him.

(Don't ask me why I didn't report, this guy died last Spring)
 
seb said:
Like I said the reason for the lower number in China probably has a lot to do with how seriously they take crime. If we did the same thing I'm sure the number of people doing time as well as the crime rate would probably drop like a rock. However, in the US with all the guns out there and even with the open carry, don't you feel safer? I sure do!
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NOPE! Tell you this whats difference between here and China is EDUCATION, they were taught to take respect SERIOUSLY, here in America, there is no such thing as respect. Nobody gets punish for lack of respect, in China, if you don't respect you get your ass screwed simple as is. On the top of this, Kids spend more time in school in China than in United States.

In China, you need to pass calculus in High school, here in America, well thats an option and can be done in college.
If you fail in art class in China, your on hot seat, but here in USA, oh thats optional and its ok to fail, don't worry we Americans no longer need cursive writing... After all!

That is what the difference are.
 
seb said:
Like I said the reason for the lower number in China probably has a lot to do with how seriously they take crime. If we did the same thing I'm sure the number of people doing time as well as the crime rate would probably drop like a rock. However, in the US with all the guns out there and even with the open carry, don't you feel safer? I sure do!
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You should do a little research into China and their statistics. Besides, how is punishment supposed to deter a mass killer who's end game is death by cop? Or the gang banger who sells guns and thinks he's a street soldier?
 
diehardbiker said:
NOPE! Tell you this whats difference between here and China is EDUCATION, they were taught to take respect SERIOUSLY, here in America, there is no such thing as respect. Nobody gets punish for lack of respect, in China, if you don't respect you get your ass screwed simple as is. On the top of this, Kids spend more time in school in China than in United States.

In China, you need to pass calculus in High school, here in America, well thats an option and can be done in college.
If you fail in art class in China, your on hot seat, but here in USA, oh thats optional and its ok to fail, don't worry we Americans no longer need cursive writing... After all!

That is what the difference are.
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Not exactly disagreeing with you... But it seems by your post that it is more a social mindset then it is education...
I do see what you are saying though, but seems a deeper social thing then an educational one... But then again, are the two not connected through the raising of their youth...
 
China has been around for 5000 years, we The United States is only two hundred thirty nine years old. Firearms was invented in China, up to you believe it or not.
 
Jezie said:
Not exactly disagreeing with you... But it seems by your post that it is more a social mindset then it is education...
I do see what you are saying though, but seems a deeper social thing then an educational one... But then again, are the two not connected through the raising of their youth...
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I agree with social mindset. Americans are more individual-focused, and Chinese are more society-focused. They see the obligations toward their society to be of higher precedence than their rights as individuals. The greater good concept.
 
diehardbiker said:
China has been around for 5000 years, we The United States is only two hundred thirty nine years old. Firearms was invented in China, up to you believe it or not.
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. . . and the point is…?
 
Reba said:
I agree with social mindset. Americans are more individual-focused, and Chinese are more society-focused. They see the obligations toward their society to be of higher precedence than their rights as individuals. The greater good concept.
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Agreed... In some way this works for them... But when you have a population the size of China add their history and it what works for them would never fly in the US... Many people keep stating that they like this or that aspect of a country; they forget about everything that leads up to it. Almost none of which jibes well with the American mindset nor her culture... Our history is too deeply independent and singular... Yes we care about society... But as a society we see individual issues, people, and groups...
 
diehardbiker said:
NOPE! Tell you this whats difference between here and China is EDUCATION, they were taught to take respect SERIOUSLY, here in America, there is no such thing as respect. Nobody gets punish for lack of respect, in China, if you don't respect you get your ass screwed simple as is. On the top of this, Kids spend more time in school in China than in United States.

In China, you need to pass calculus in High school, here in America, well thats an option and can be done in college.
If you fail in art class in China, your on hot seat, but here in USA, oh thats optional and its ok to fail, don't worry we Americans no longer need cursive writing... After all!

That is what the difference are.
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Education does play a role, but your getting confused between China and Japan. Japanese people will not touch what isn't theirs, Chinese will. Japanese and Chinese will and do respect their elders. However, in regards to crime China does surpass the US in one key statistic and that is violent crime murder rate: China ranks 6th in the world, the US is 9th. China basically does not allow it's citizens to own guns, however, you can apply for a permit to allow you to own a gun for hunting purposes only. However, illegal possession of a firearm carries a minimum punishment is 3 years in prison and the maximum penalty is death. Like I said they take crime and gun use seriously.
 
Where did they get social mindset from?

Reba said:
I agree with social mindset. Americans are more individual-focused, and Chinese are more society-focused. They see the obligations toward their society to be of higher precedence than their rights as individuals. The greater good concept.
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jonnyghost said:
You should do a little research into China and their statistics. Besides, how is punishment supposed to deter a mass killer who's end game is death by cop? Or the gang banger who sells guns and thinks he's a street soldier?
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Big difference between China and US is in China citizens aren't allowed to own guns. In recent years in the US the vast majority of these mass murderers haven't been killed by cops, but have taken their own life.
 
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Sure, but don't forget their government can barge in anyone's house anytime as they see fit.

But the truth is, there is plenty of illegal guns in China, you may be surprised, and often China government don't want to admit they may have problems too and said "we don't have problem here". Communist known for covering up and lies. Whats more in China, all Internet transmission is censored and if there is something China government don't like that we should know, they block it.

If you liked China so much, move there, will you?

seb said:
Big difference between China and US is in China citizens aren't allowed to own guns. In resent years in the US the vast majority of these mass murderers haven't been killed by cops, but have taken their own life.
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diehardbiker said:
Don't forget, they STILL can get guns from street dealer, that is the meaning of black market. Many guns have been stolen, sold illegal and so on. HOW can you stop that? Gun control? My ass!

Let me tell you what I have witness, I was there the whole time when one of my old friend got so mad that a guy raped his girlfriend, he came to me and need ride. I was like ok, then go down to street and he said stay here I will be back. I watched what he did, he looked at handgun, he was ready to buy it... I had to stop him, man! I couldn't believe how EASY it was! That is where you overlooked. Glad I was able to stop him.

(Don't ask me why I didn't report, this guy died last Spring)
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I have posted about this before on this site. Until we hold gun owners responsible for their guns and make them financially responsible for their guns if they are stolen, we will continue to have a black market for guns. Make a gun owner actually be required to buy a real safe to store their guns in and not one of those so called gun safes that they sell at gun stores or Home Depot and you might see the number of guns available on the streets go down.
The real problem we have in the US is irresponsible gun ownership and allowing people who should not be allowed to own guns, have them and the NRA plays on this by saying the only way you can be safe is to be allowed to buy a gun and even carry it and all this does is make us less safe because peoples houses get broken into and their guns get stolen and then used in the commission of a crime.
 
Please keep in mind, guns can be stolen ANYWHERE in the world, and sold overseas all the time, which makes it impossible controlling black market.

Let me tell you this there was a rarity of school shooting before the reform of education program back in 1972, and right before that education reform cops had shoot students in Kent University back in late 60's don't forget it and that is government agencies that shot innocents to begin with. After the education reform was complete, BOOM! we saw much more mass shooting and killing. Doesn't this paint whats behind these shooting, eh?

seb said:
I have posted about this before on this site. Until we hold gun owners responsible for their guns and make them financially responsible for their guns if they are stolen, we will continue to have a black market for guns. Make a gun owner actually be required to buy a real safe to store their guns in and not one of those so called gun safes that they sell at gun stores or Home Depot and you might see the number of guns available on the streets go down.
The real problem we have in the US is irresponsible gun ownership and allowing people who should not be allowed to own guns, have them and the NRA plays on this by saying the only way you can be safe is to be allowed to buy a gun and even carry it and all this does is make us less safe because peoples houses get broken into and their guns get stolen and then used in the commission of a crime.
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seb said:
I have posted about this before on this site. Until we hold gun owners responsible for their guns and make them financially responsible for their guns if they are stolen, we will continue to have a black market for guns. Make a gun owner actually be required to buy a real safe to store their guns in and not one of those so called gun safes that they sell at gun stores or Home Depot and you might see the number of guns available on the streets go down.
The real problem we have in the US is irresponsible gun ownership and allowing people who should not be allowed to own guns, have them and the NRA plays on this by saying the only way you can be safe is to be allowed to buy a gun and even carry it and all this does is make us less safe because peoples houses get broken into and their guns get stolen and then used in the commission of a crime.
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Wait... Hello... I have had two guns stolen from me... They were in a locked house with an alarm in a locked safe and bolted to the ground... I was out of town for my daughter's funeral... So, by your standard I should have been killed by the state or sued because I should be held liable for the assisting in the crimes committed with my guns... Hmm... A domestic male bovine's excrement...
 
In the first 200 years of the United States, there were only two mass shooting at school, the last 40 years of the United States... I have lost the count on school massacres. If we were smart enough, we could have looked in what changes that made 40 years ago and see if there is possibility relationship and what needs to undo the change that was made back 40 years ago.

The idea of gun control in the United states didn't show up until mid 1960's

That should be sufficient telltale cause of whats happening lately.

This is precisely why I am pointing at education as root cause of all evil we saw today. Society mindset were developed though school, no question about it... Don't tell me its home at fault, because often at home may not expose to society like in school where student interacts as in society thus develop mindset from there.
 
Noticed most mass shooters usually young male that just got out of school or about to get out of school. Doesn't this tell something, eh?

Lastly, I am curious what the shooter had to say in thumbstick (memory stick) and document that lucky guy promised to hand over police and watch him shoot 9. I feel bad for this guy, his mind is messed up for rest of his life.

Hope whatever in the memory stick shines on why he decided to shoot and take his own life. I DO know why he wanted to take his own life... afraid may be stuck in jail for rest of his life.
 
diehardbiker said:
Let me ask you, why this 11 years old boy decided to shoot a girl who refused allow him play with her puppy?

http://www.cnn.com/2015/10/07/us/tennessee-girl-killed-puppy/

Please don't suggested that this is irrelevant, it is relevant because the root cause of shooting is likely to be similar reason behind the shooting. Don't need to be rocket scientist to figure out.
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I will bite... Why?
I see the rise in gun violence as a reflection of our social mindset and attitude about guns and crime/criminals.
 
Greedy for most part. They think all for themselves. Sad, school fail to educate the importance of respect and accept if being rejected. Nowadays younger generation seems to have trouble dealing with rejections.

Jezie said:
I will bite... Why?
I see the rise in gun violence as a reflection of our social mindset and attitude about guns and crime/criminals.
Click to expand...
 
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