Please tell Blu-Ray to support Closed Caption CC - Page 2

souggy · 11-25-2009, 05:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frisky Feline

Oh he asked you to buy him a blu ray player? lol i think xbox has blu ray? si?

Only HD-DVD, and that format got discontinued.

PS3 supports Blu-Ray.

Frisky Feline · 11-25-2009, 05:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by souggy

Only HD-DVD, and that format got discontinued.

PS3 supports Blu-Ray.

Oh. thanks then tell jiros brother to get ps3 that has blu ray.

darkage · 11-25-2009, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peternagy

I think HD Homerun is probably the best choice because it can tune to HDTV ClearQAM which is available for free from your local cable company.

Peter

Usually, QAM will not show all channels. Just channel from 2 to 49 or 50.

Verizon FIOS does not support QAM. We have HDTV with built-in QAM. Still no picture from Verizon FIOS.

***Calvin*** · 11-25-2009, 10:28 PM

Blu-ray has more sharper picture and best sound effects than DVD.

Blu-ray disc = 25gb
DVD = 4.7 gb

Blu-ray is better choice for action movies cuz of sound effects. Others, I can just use DVD with it. I don't go buy every blu ray out there, only those with great action movies. I currently have few blu ray while majority is DVD.

**Banjo** · 11-25-2009, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calvin

Blu-ray has more sharper picture and best sound effects than DVD.

Blu-ray disc = 25gb
DVD = 4.7 gb

Blu-ray is better choice for action movies cuz of sound effects. Others, I can just use DVD with it. I don't go buy every blu ray out there, only those with great action movies. I currently have few blu ray while majority is DVD.

Single Layered DVD - 4.7 GB
Dual Layered DVD - 9.4 GB
Single Layered Blu-ray Disc - 25 GB
Dual Layered Blu-ray Disc - 50 GB

***Calvin*** · 11-25-2009, 10:45 PM

Yes, that's correct.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Banjo

Single Layered DVD - 4.7 GB
Dual Layered DVD - 9.4 GB
Single Layered Blu-ray Disc - 25 GB
Dual Layered Blu-ray Disc - 50 GB

Boult · 11-25-2009, 11:41 PM

I would prefer that from now on that all DVD (any formats) be subtitled using SDH instead of CC or OC! (that would make easier for online streaming from netflix or hulu or as such!)

Steel X · 11-26-2009, 03:20 AM

CC is nearly impossible and complicated to go thru the HD signals...its something they need to work on BEFORE the blu-ray association do something. Besides, ALL blu-ray discs have subtitles so why bother?

darkage · 11-26-2009, 10:07 AM

Yesterday, I asked few workers at Best Buy. We talked about CC, SDH and Subtitle. They were glad to bring few "opened box" Blu-Ray players and two different movies. We did try 5 or 6 different model of Blu-Ray players. Not see any SDH or CC. They show only Subtitle. We tried to set up CC1 on HDTV but not available for HDMI. We tried two different model of HDTV. Still not support. I told worker that I will ask someone at forum.

Are you use HDMI or other Cable?
What brand of Blu-Ray players support SDH?
Some movies are not available in SDH?
Where to find special set up at Menu on blu-ray player? We did try - no luck.
Not see any SDH on blu-ray's remote.

We looked about 8 different Blu-Ray movie's packages. Some packages show "SDH" or CC or Subtitle for deaf...... We never understand why that we can't get any special CC or SDH.

souggy · 11-26-2009, 11:13 AM

*smacks head*

SDH is listed in the "Subtitles" menu.

It's usually listed as "Subtitled for the Deaf and Hard-of-Hearing." Every Disney movie I have on DVD has SDH when I got the Languages option in the movie itself.

Not hard. All SDH is a subtitle with auditory explanation that like a gun going off, or the lyrics to a song (which not all closed captioning or subtitles have.)

darkage · 11-26-2009, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by souggy

*smacks head*

SDH is listed in the "Subtitles" menu.

It's usually listed as "Subtitled for the Deaf and Hard-of-Hearing." Every Disney movie I have on DVD has SDH when I got the Languages option in the movie itself.

Not hard. All SDH is a subtitle with auditory explanation that like a gun going off, or the lyrics to a song (which not all closed captioning or subtitles have.)

We looked menu at Subtitle. They have only English, Spanish and French. Not see any "SDH" in Subtitle's list.
They showed display subtitle but I do not like it because always show CC on bottom-always center. We tried two different movies. They do not have any SDH at all. We understand that blu-ray movie will not refuse or exchange unless never open package. I will not buy blu-ray player.

LuciaDisturbed · 11-27-2009, 01:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calvin

Blu-ray has more sharper picture and best sound effects than DVD.

Blu-ray disc = 25gb
DVD = 4.7 gb

Blu-ray is better choice for action movies cuz of sound effects. Others, I can just use DVD with it. I don't go buy every blu ray out there, only those with great action movies. I currently have few blu ray while majority is DVD.

I don't have perfect vision so it makes no difference whether I watch regular DVD or Blue Ray DVD. Especially since my stupid glasses broke. I don't care for sound effects, since my tv in my bedroom has a busted speaker so I don't hear the TV too well. And I am not going to buy a new TV - I am poor lol. Yeah, I have two other TVs but my bedroom TV is the one I use most. and I have a DVD player hooked up to this one. And this TV has a built in VHS player, for all my old VHS movies. I am quite happy with what I have. What I really need more is a new laptop than a new TV or new Blue Ray player.

peternagy · 11-27-2009, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkage

We looked menu at Subtitle. They have only English, Spanish and French. Not see any "SDH" in Subtitle's list.
They showed display subtitle but I do not like it because always show CC on bottom-always center. We tried two different movies. They do not have any SDH at all. We understand that blu-ray movie will not refuse or exchange unless never open package. I will not buy blu-ray player.

"Subtitles" are just as good as "SDH". Not all studios label "SDH" and when it only shows "Subtitles", it could also meant "SDH". I can't really tell the difference between both.

Bottom line is if you are using HDMI or DVI cable between DVD/Blu-ray player and TV, forget about trying to get CC to work. You have to use SDH/Subtitles with this cable hookup.

Peter

souggy · 11-27-2009, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peternagy

"Subtitles" are just as good as "SDH". Not all studios label "SDH" and when it only shows "Subtitles", it could also meant "SDH". I can't really tell the difference between both.

Bottom line is if you are using HDMI or DVI cable between DVD/Blu-ray player and TV, forget about trying to get CC to work. You have to use SDH/Subtitles with this cable hookup.

Peter

Banjo's World: HDTV Captioning: What You Should Know

A scene with English subtitle:

A scene with SDH:

peternagy · 11-27-2009, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by souggy

Banjo's World: HDTV Captioning: What You Should Know

A scene with English subtitle:

A scene with SDH:

I am aware of that. Maybe I was not clear in my previous post. What I was trying to say that there's no guarantee when the menu only says "Subtiltles" and not "SDH" when they meant it's really "SDH". And vice versa.

Like I said before, good luck on trying to display CC over HDMI/DVI cable because there's very little chance of getting it. Subtitles or SDH is your best chance when using HDMI/DVI cable.

Peter

darkage · 11-28-2009, 08:34 AM

Last Wednesday (day before Thanksgiving day), last year, two years ago, three years ago, we did ask salespeople at few different stores (CompUSA, Circuit City, Best Buy and other stores). They did set up for us. We played with remote at menu and watch movie. We never see any SHD on Blu-Ray movies. I would say that we did try 10 different movies but never see any SHD at all.

I still dislike English Subtitle (very good example at Banjo's website)

I seem that they do not have many movies with SHD.

Boult · 11-28-2009, 06:31 PM

SDH is subtitle! There are two type of english subtitle one is just subtitle and other is SDH which stand for "Subtitle for Deaf and Hard of Hearing"
Subtitle (captioning) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Quote:

High definition disc media (HD DVD, Blu-ray disc) uses SDH subtitles as the sole method because technical specifications do not require HD to support line 21 closed captions. Some blu-ray discs, however, are said to carry a closed caption stream that only displays through standard definition connections. Many HDTVs allow the end–user to customize the captions, including the ability to remove the black band.

SDH is used in same concept as CC but does not use Line 21 to display.

I would prefer SDH because many movie studios prefer to use subtitle over cc so I encourage them to include SDH whenever they include regular subtitle.

Boult · 11-28-2009, 06:37 PM

Also if you have a DVR cable box that have CC decoder then you can use either HDMI or Component (notice I said Component not Composite) cable. Then you will need to enable cc in DVR and turn off CC in TV.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1036172

peternagy · 11-29-2009, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boult

Also if you have a DVR cable box that have CC decoder then you can use either HDMI or Component (notice I said Component not Composite) cable. Then you will need to enable cc in DVR and turn off CC in TV.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1036172

You don't have to turn off digital CC in TV. CC decoders in TV cannot decode digital CC from any external sources (DVR, DVD players, etc) using HDMI/DVI/Component cables. CC decoders in TV are for OTA antenna only. Leave CC enabled in TV in case you are still using OTA antenna. That's how I set up mine.

Peter

**Chevy57** · 11-29-2009, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boult

Also if you have a DVR cable box that have CC decoder then you can use either HDMI or Component (notice I said Component not Composite) cable. Then you will need to enable cc in DVR and turn off CC in TV.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1036172

HDMI don't support closed captioned programs from DVR cable decoder. Better use component cable.

peternagy · 11-29-2009, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chevy57

HDMI don't support closed captioned programs from DVR cable decoder. Better use component cable.

That's partially correct. But DVR cable box (or other external sources if supported) can "trick" HDMI by overlaying CC text onto video signal as if it behaves like subtitles (or SDH) and transmit to TV via any digital cable like HDMI, DVI or even component. HDMI does not care what goes on the video signal. What HDMI does not support is the ability to "decode" CC using line 21.

Peter

**Chevy57** · 11-29-2009, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peternagy

That's partially correct. But DVR cable box (or other external sources if supported) can "trick" HDMI by overlaying CC text onto video signal as if it behaves like subtitles (or SDH) and transmit to TV via any digital cable like HDMI, DVI or even component. HDMI does not care what goes on the video signal. What HDMI does not support is the ability to "decode" CC using line 21.

Peter

Right. Why can't HDMI be CC in using Line 21. I have my HDMI cable for my Blu-Ray player in using SHD and subtitle. This subtitle is very clearer and no background box than yellow blurr text in using DVD player.

peternagy · 11-29-2009, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chevy57

Right. Why can't HDMI be CC in using Line 21. I have my HDMI cable for my Blu-Ray player in using SHD and subtitle. This subtitle is very clearer and no background box than yellow blurr text in using DVD player.

That's probably an oversight by HDMI committee. I believe line 21 is designed for analog CC, not digital CC. But I prefer subtitle or SDH and technology is probably cheaper than using CC for studios or DVD/Blu-ray manufacturers.

Peter

snafu · 12-27-2009, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Besides, ALL blu-ray discs have subtitles so why bother?

some people, like me, bought a new blu-ray player, expecting to be able to watch their existing DVD collection. Many of my DVDs are CC, but not subtitled. I have my new blu-ray player hooked up with regular old audio video cables, just to see CC. Kind of defeats the purpose of buying the blu-ray player. I tried component cables, but I can't get any CC with them, and there are no options or settings regarding CC either.

peternagy · 12-28-2009, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by snafu

some people, like me, bought a new blu-ray player, expecting to be able to watch their existing DVD collection. Many of my DVDs are CC, but not subtitled. I have my new blu-ray player hooked up with regular old audio video cables, just to see CC. Kind of defeats the purpose of buying the blu-ray player. I tried component cables, but I can't get any CC with them, and there are no options or settings regarding CC either.

Video signals from players to TVs must be in "interlace" or "non-progressive" scan mode in order to display CC (line 21). If you set your player to "Interlace" or "non-progressive" scan mode, your TV might be able to display CC with component cables. My Panasonic Blu-ray player has component settings for 480i, 480p, 720p and 1080i. Try set it to 480i. I don't own DVD discs because I rent from Netflix so I can't test it. I currrently use HDMI cable and watch Blu-ray movies with subtitles.

If it works for you, you can always change video out of your Blu-ray player to progressive scan or 1080i/1080p when you watch Blu-ray movies with subtitles without changing cables.

Peter

snafu · 12-28-2009, 07:58 PM

yes, I back when I got the machine, I did try setting my blu-ray player on "480i" but I still didn't see any captions.

It could be my TV. It's an LCD TV (not HD) from back in 2004.

I was wondering something else. If I have my blu-ray player connected to my TV with old a/v cables, AND at the same time connected to the TV with component cables... when I'm watching an old DVD with CC, I can go to options on my player and select "analog output to TV". Then if I am watching a DVD or blu-ray disc with subtitles, can I change the option on the player to "connected to TV by component cable". I mean, my player has a setting for "connected to tv by analog cables" and "connected to tv by component cable" and a setting for "connected to tv by hdmi cable". so my question is, can I have the player connected to a TV with two of those cables, or even all 3 types at the same time, and just switch my option back and forth depending on what type of disc I am watching? That would be better than switching cables around on back for different discs.

peternagy · 12-28-2009, 11:57 PM

It won't hurt to try. I would use only two cables: HDMI for subtitles and Composite (A/V) for CC. You probably don't have to do change any settings on Blu-ray player. Just simply change the inputs (HDMI or Composite) of your TV via remote control. Let us know the outcome.

Peter

**sequoias** · 12-28-2009, 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peternagy

Video signals from players to TVs must be in "interlace" or "non-progressive" scan mode in order to display CC (line 21). If you set your player to "Interlace" or "non-progressive" scan mode, your TV might be able to display CC with component cables. My Panasonic Blu-ray player has component settings for 480i, 480p, 720p and 1080i. Try set it to 480i. I don't own DVD discs because I rent from Netflix so I can't test it. I currrently use HDMI cable and watch Blu-ray movies with subtitles.

If it works for you, you can always change video out of your Blu-ray player to progressive scan or 1080i/1080p when you watch Blu-ray movies with subtitles without changing cables.

Peter

Um, what about digital CC? They display fine with 720p signals. It would be nice that blu ray would support digital CC instead of the SDH. I find SDH harder to read compared to the CC.

Steel X · 12-29-2009, 04:00 PM

I really wouldnt care about CC since most blu-ray movies include subtitles, which is good enough for me.

gambitz · 09-11-2010, 05:34 PM

You guys have your preferences between CC and SDH.

My gripe with SDH is that it has few negatives.

1. MOST SDH do not have "positional" texts. such as right, left, top, bottom, etc so we will know who is speaking. All in the middle has confused me alot of times on who is speaking.

2. SDH with no black background SUCKS! It is hard to read.

3. SDH does not ALWAYS show full background noise. For example, movie: Zombieland it shows [yelling] but it does not show "banging on door" I was confused why did the guy answer the door? I asked my hearing friend, he said yes somebody was banging on the door. OHHHHH..... I'm pissed... I think on around 14 minutes into the movie if you want to check it out.

4. Most quite simply the worse that pisses me off. I HAVE TO TURN ON SDH ON EVERY MOVIE. With CC, it's already turned on and auto shown.

My deaf kids know how to turn on the TV and they have CC. But if they turn on blu-ray and they dont know how to turn on Subtitles and they cant read perfect, maybe choose wrong language?

ALSO I HATE TO TURN IT ON EVERY TIME. Not fair that hearing people turn on TV or Blu-Ray and it auto have sound. BUT WE HAVE TO TURN ON SDH EVERY TIME.. WHY??

KEEP CC because it is auto and it simply works. NOBODY COMPLAINED ABOUT CC. But alot of people complain about subtitles.

PEROID.

11-26-2009, 11:13 AM	#40 (permalink)
souggy Registered User Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Pacific Northwest Posts: 9,541	smacks head SDH is listed in the "Subtitles" menu. It's usually listed as "Subtitled for the Deaf and Hard-of-Hearing." Every Disney movie I have on DVD has SDH when I got the Languages option in the movie itself. Not hard. All SDH is a subtitle with auditory explanation that like a gun going off, or the lyrics to a song (which not all closed captioning or subtitles have.) __________________ "It is my task to convince you not to turn away because you don’t understand it." - Richard Freynman

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11-25-2009, 10:28 PM	#34 (permalink)
*Calvin* Moderator Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 4,932	Blu-ray has more sharper picture and best sound effects than DVD. Blu-ray disc = 25gb DVD = 4.7 gb Blu-ray is better choice for action movies cuz of sound effects. Others, I can just use DVD with it. I don't go buy every blu ray out there, only those with great action movies. I currently have few blu ray while majority is DVD.

11-26-2009, 03:20 AM	#38 (permalink)
Steel X Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: The Carolinas/Rochester, NY. Posts: 13,824	CC is nearly impossible and complicated to go thru the HD signals...its something they need to work on BEFORE the blu-ray association do something. Besides, ALL blu-ray discs have subtitles so why bother?

11-26-2009, 10:07 AM	#39 (permalink)
darkage Registered User Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 1,717	Yesterday, I asked few workers at Best Buy. We talked about CC, SDH and Subtitle. They were glad to bring few "opened box" Blu-Ray players and two different movies. We did try 5 or 6 different model of Blu-Ray players. Not see any SDH or CC. They show only Subtitle. We tried to set up CC1 on HDTV but not available for HDMI. We tried two different model of HDTV. Still not support. I told worker that I will ask someone at forum. Are you use HDMI or other Cable? What brand of Blu-Ray players support SDH? Some movies are not available in SDH? Where to find special set up at Menu on blu-ray player? We did try - no luck. Not see any SDH on blu-ray's remote. We looked about 8 different Blu-Ray movie's packages. Some packages show "SDH" or CC or Subtitle for deaf...... We never understand why that we can't get any special CC or SDH.

11-28-2009, 08:34 AM	#46 (permalink)
darkage Registered User Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 1,717	Last Wednesday (day before Thanksgiving day), last year, two years ago, three years ago, we did ask salespeople at few different stores (CompUSA, Circuit City, Best Buy and other stores). They did set up for us. We played with remote at menu and watch movie. We never see any SHD on Blu-Ray movies. I would say that we did try 10 different movies but never see any SHD at all. I still dislike English Subtitle (very good example at Banjo's website) I seem that they do not have many movies with SHD.

12-28-2009, 07:58 PM	#56 (permalink)
snafu Registered User Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 7	yes, I back when I got the machine, I did try setting my blu-ray player on "480i" but I still didn't see any captions. It could be my TV. It's an LCD TV (not HD) from back in 2004. I was wondering something else. If I have my blu-ray player connected to my TV with old a/v cables, AND at the same time connected to the TV with component cables... when I'm watching an old DVD with CC, I can go to options on my player and select "analog output to TV". Then if I am watching a DVD or blu-ray disc with subtitles, can I change the option on the player to "connected to TV by component cable". I mean, my player has a setting for "connected to tv by analog cables" and "connected to tv by component cable" and a setting for "connected to tv by hdmi cable". so my question is, can I have the player connected to a TV with two of those cables, or even all 3 types at the same time, and just switch my option back and forth depending on what type of disc I am watching? That would be better than switching cables around on back for different discs.

12-28-2009, 11:57 PM	#57 (permalink)
peternagy Registered User Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Reno, NV Posts: 186	It won't hurt to try. I would use only two cables: HDMI for subtitles and Composite (A/V) for CC. You probably don't have to do change any settings on Blu-ray player. Just simply change the inputs (HDMI or Composite) of your TV via remote control. Let us know the outcome. Peter

12-29-2009, 04:00 PM	#59 (permalink)
Steel X Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: The Carolinas/Rochester, NY. Posts: 13,824	I really wouldnt care about CC since most blu-ray movies include subtitles, which is good enough for me.

09-11-2010, 05:34 PM	#60 (permalink)
gambitz Registered User Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1	You guys have your preferences between CC and SDH. My gripe with SDH is that it has few negatives. 1. MOST SDH do not have "positional" texts. such as right, left, top, bottom, etc so we will know who is speaking. All in the middle has confused me alot of times on who is speaking. 2. SDH with no black background SUCKS! It is hard to read. 3. SDH does not ALWAYS show full background noise. For example, movie: Zombieland it shows [yelling] but it does not show "banging on door" I was confused why did the guy answer the door? I asked my hearing friend, he said yes somebody was banging on the door. OHHHHH..... I'm pissed... I think on around 14 minutes into the movie if you want to check it out. 4. Most quite simply the worse that pisses me off. I HAVE TO TURN ON SDH ON EVERY MOVIE. With CC, it's already turned on and auto shown. My deaf kids know how to turn on the TV and they have CC. But if they turn on blu-ray and they dont know how to turn on Subtitles and they cant read perfect, maybe choose wrong language? ALSO I HATE TO TURN IT ON EVERY TIME. Not fair that hearing people turn on TV or Blu-Ray and it auto have sound. BUT WE HAVE TO TURN ON SDH EVERY TIME.. WHY?? KEEP CC because it is auto and it simply works. NOBODY COMPLAINED ABOUT CC. But alot of people complain about subtitles. PEROID.