Terps - Page 5

AquaBlue · 03-02-2008, 12:37 PM

Ignore what people say? Is that what you said Etoile? That's funny. All I do is listen and if I need to adjust my ways, I do it. Show me where I have ignored what people say. I want to see it.

AquaBlue · 03-02-2008, 12:50 PM

The Deaf are a strong, courageous, intellectual and proud people who deserve nothing more and nothing less than the outmost respect and honor given them. How can it be possible for me to not be respectful to such ones, to such a beautiful culture/people? What can't they do that a hearing person can? They are great and I look forward to not only learning about their culture but also entering it and sharing their pride- their Deaf pride.

Come on now, let's maintain our association civil and let’s forget that this dispute ever took place. It was just a misunderstanding on your part. Let's move on.

Tousi · 03-02-2008, 01:44 PM

Well, AB, you're the one who wanted the input. I agree with Anji, Etoile and some others that it is just simply axiomatic that language and culture go hand in hand. In fact,I would not worry so much about having every book on sign language ever published and getting set for the day you venture out. Get some of those books, especially the ones on the culture, if you must, but attend deaf socials, meetings, etc now rather than waiting until you think you are ready. Your progress will be much faster by leaps and bounds re: the mechanics of sign and the culture if you would just jump right in and leave all your sensibilities, defense mechanisms at home under the bed.

AquaBlue · 03-02-2008, 02:00 PM

Ah I am in agreement with you Tousi. But you are not stating the same thing as Anji and Etoile...not by a long shot. I am, as I said before, awaiting a Deaf culture book to arrive at my local public library. So my lessons are going to begin once it arrives.

Now as for the Deaf gathering, I will attend one as soon as find one. The e-mails I sent have not been returned so I am in a wait-and-see mode now; if they do not reply, I will find other sources that can help me. If I can't find such I will press the two folks I e-mailed first. If no reply is given then I will personally go the college and ask for the director of the sign language department.

I am going to a Deaf gathering even if it kills me.

Tousi at least you didn't say that I disrespect the Deaf culture. I thank you for not doing so: Nothing could be further from the truth.

AquaBlue · 03-02-2008, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tousi

leave all your sensibilities, defense mechanisms at home under the bed.

AquaBlue · 03-02-2008, 03:22 PM

Terps, please don't give me the cold shoulder. I need your advice and experience.

Anij · 03-02-2008, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AquaBlue

Respectfully speaking Anij, I think you are wrong. I am not guilty of anything you stated. Maybe I am being interpreted inaccurately (I must be) because your post does not serve me well. I understand all of what you meant and I am baffled, truly. Is as if you are talking about another person, not me.

Let's agree Anij; and let's get things clear, I do not have to sit down and think of what I am going to accomplish. I know that one day I will become a Terp regardless of your discouraging words. If for some strange reason I am wrong and you are right (fat chance) then I will be humble myself and listen: I'll be all ears. But for now I disagree with your words Anij.

Please don’t get upset.

AquaBlue,
My words aren't meant to be discouraging ...they're meant to be honest.

I'm not entirely sure exactly what you think I have accused you of??

I'm simply saying that you would be able to learn more about Deaf Culture, Deaf Community, and the process of learning ASL if you would ask EVERYONE instead of continually asking specific Groups (hearing, Terps - interestingly I haven't seen you ask hh or Deaf about the process of learning ASL)

I think and hope it's a matter of the style and wording you use in your posts - whether you mean it to be or not , it comes across as separatist ... if we can misunderstand you here ... it will be WAY worse once you start interacting at social things. We, and I want to help you through this process, we want to offer our advise, but it seems more often than not you're interested in telling us how you're doing something instead of asking for advise. On the occasions you do ask, we offer suggestions, but you don't seem keen to take them as valuable. We have given suggestion on meeting people, books, fingerspelling techniques, cultural awareness ... and cautioned you when in ignorance (which simply means lack of knowledge, it's not a negative thing) you make a faux pas.

If you want to enter our world.. you need to take a deep breath and as us questions, but only if you'll accept the suggestions we give.

The interpreters on here are wonderful people ... but don't you think you should ask everyone for their help on learning basics ?? Don't you think it would be more respectful on a hh/D/d forum to ask US as well ? You may not even realise you're excluding and that's the very reason some of us have pointed it out...

I'm not accusing you of anything other than being new, and struggling with how to learn a new language and enter into a new culture. I am frankly concerned that you still have a lot of growing to do and would rather you made the mistakes here, than with people you might one day end up interpreting with...

The choice is up to you ... value us, value our knowledge - or just say that you do.

Anij · 03-02-2008, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AquaBlue

Terps, please don't give me the cold shoulder. I need your advice and experience.

AquaBlue · 03-02-2008, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anij

I'm simply saying that you would be able to learn more about Deaf Culture, Deaf Community, and the process of learning ASL if you would ask EVERYONE instead of continually asking specific Groups (hearing, Terps - interestingly I haven't seen you ask hh or Deaf about the process of learning ASL)

Because I only want the perspective of Terps. It does matter to me if the Terp answering my questions is hearing, deaf or hard-of-hearing. I never discluded anyone.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anij

I think and hope it's a matter of the style and wording you use in your posts - whether you mean it to be or not , it comes across as separatist ... if we can misunderstand you here ... it will be WAY worse once you start interacting at social things. We, and I want to help you through this process, we want to offer our advise, but it seems more often than not you're interested in telling us how you're doing something instead of asking for advise. On the occasions you do ask, we offer suggestions, but you don't seem keen to take them as valuable. We have given suggestion on meeting people, books, fingerspelling techniques, cultural awareness ... and cautioned you when in ignorance (which simply means lack of knowledge, it's not a negative thing) you make a faux pas.

All that is incorrect. I don't buy it because it is not true. It is the reversal of what you're say. I do follow the suggestions given and I do appreciate the help. If it seems otherwise then I am sorry for that...my phrasing must be wrong.

I value you (terps) and that's it. Do not doubt it because I am being honest.

AquaBlue · 03-02-2008, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anij

I am just afraid Anij that the Terps on the forum will stop giving me advice because of the misunderstanding. Maybe the are thinking wrongly like you.

Etoile · 03-02-2008, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AquaBlue

Because I only want the perspective of Terps. It does matter to me if the Terp answering my questions is hearing, deaf or hard-of-hearing. I never discluded anyone.

I am curious then, some of your questions have been about ASL grammar, why would you decline responses from people who are deaf and fluent in ASL?

Quote:

Originally Posted by AquaBlue

All that is incorrect. I don't buy it because it is not true. It is the reversal of what you're say. I do follow the suggestions given and I do appreciate the help. If it seems otherwise then I am sorry for that...my phrasing must be wrong.

I think that must be the problem. I think that, a lot of the time, the way you put things comes across as offensive without meaning to. For example, the things you said about ASL in the "why are there many signs for one word" thread sounded like you were telling everybody the way ASL ought to be, even though you do not fully know ASL yourself.

I believe you are good-intentioned, but I think a lot of the time you step on toes without realizing it.

I would never withhold my knowledge because of something like this, I like to try to help people if I can. I noticed nobody has answered some of your earlier questions, so I will give my answers now.

Etoile · 03-02-2008, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Do young (in knowledge/experience) Terps usually start off working for an agency?

I think this depends a lot on where you are in the country. I live in DC, and we probably have more terps here than anywhere else in the US! Most terps here do start out working for an agency. It's a good way to establish your reputation within the Deaf community, and let people get to know your face and name, etc. Then, if you choose to go into business for yourself, your name is out there already and people will know who you are and want to hire you.

Quote:

Do agencies themselves (more or less) hire CI exclusively or does each one have it's own policy as to what is a qualified Interpreter...hiring both CIs and uncertified Terps?

Everybody has their own policy. Most agencies do hire "pre-certified" terps (the friendly term) but everybody has to go through the same screening. (Usually agencies screen everybody.)

Quote:

Is salary (not a major issue with me but still an important one) determined more on experiece or certification?

Hmm. You will probably get more if you're certified, but experience and skill level is important too. I would say it is first based on experience/skill level, and then they bump it up a bit if you're certified. That's just my perception though, I have never worked for the HR dept of an interpreting agency.

Reba · 03-02-2008, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AquaBlue

Are Deaf folks excessively sensitive to the assessments of the hearing folks?

Does anyone appreciate unsolicited "assessment"?

Are hearing folks excessively sensitive to the assessments of the deaf folks?

Reba · 03-02-2008, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

I agree. I would reccommend starting out with For Hearing People Only and then moving to texts like the Padden and Humphries book.

Reba · 03-02-2008, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Etoile

... I would also recommend picking up "So You Want to Be an Interpreter" - it is more recent, easy to read, and it's often used as a textbook in ITP's.

I second that recommendation.

jillio · 03-02-2008, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AquaBlue

I understand that people make mistakes, so I forgive you both for your blatant accusations. Now let’s get back to normal please. I hate this discussion; I hate disagreements. I am a peaceful man that strays from such things. Life is too short you know. All I ask for is help from the Terps. If this threat is going to turn into a circus then I regret that I every created it. Fighting doesn’t serve anyone (especially me) well. So, pretty please with sugar on top, let’s stop this dispute.

And know this, carve it deeply into your hearts and minds, I did not and will never be disrespectful toward the Deaf culture in no way, shape or form. Got that? Good.

Stop and think, AquaBlue. You did not intend to be disrespectful, but still and all, your wording has often been culturally insensitive. That means that you are being perceived as disrespectful whether by your cultural norms or not, the intent was there. I don't think anyone is accusing you ov being intentionally exclusionary or disrespectful, but they ar simply informing you that you are violating some of the accepted norms of Deaf culture, and threfore are perceived as disrespectful by members of that culutre. The way to correct that is to adjust yourself to the norms and values of Deaf Culture, not to insist that they adjust to you. You are learning. Part of the learning process is to listen to members of Deaf Culture, and to adjust your communication to them. Unless you are able to do that, a terp certificate will not be of much benefit, as the Deaf will not be very quick to request your services.

AquaBlue · 03-02-2008, 05:09 PM

Etoile: I am not excluding anyone. All Terps are welcome to join in the discussion and answer my questions. Where (what post) exists where I said otherwise? What I meant is that ASL should be universal? How do I step on toes Etoile? Please tell me.

Thank so much Etoile for answering my questions. I wholeheartedly appreciate you doing so and I respect you fully because of your earnest replies.

Reba: I was only asking that question out of curiosity. I did not mean any disrespect. I can see how it would be defined as a negative comment. For that I am sorry.

Reba · 03-02-2008, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AquaBlue

I had an idea and I wanted your input. When I practice my fingerspelling I would visit this site to improve my retention.

Do you mean to improve your receptive skills?

Quote:

And this site for fingerspelling drills.

Do you mean you are using this site to practice expressive fingerspelling by yourself? Do you have a live practice partner? You can get better practice and feedback with a live partner.

Quote:

But as regards to both sites I find that they use no useful words in the examples given. You don’t gain any further understanding with such words.

You are using them for spelling drills, not vocabulary drills.

Quote:

... you gain better control over all fingerspelled words and fix errors (like misspelled words).

When you are spelling to others you should be accurate with your spelling.

When you are reading others spelling to you, don't get too hung up on perfect spelling. Often you've got to let your mind "fill in the gaps" or "ignore mistakes"--"closure" of the word.

Quote:

That's it. What do you think?

If you're intending to become an interpreter, you need to also practice hearing the words then spelling them, not spelling from printed lists. Listen to a talk radio program or TV news program and practice spelling words that you hear. That's good expressive practice.

Reba · 03-02-2008, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AquaBlue

Reba: I was only asking that question out of curiosity. I did not mean any disrespect. I can see how it would be defined as a negative comment. For that I am sorry.

I just wanted you to see how that question sounded from another perspective.

AquaBlue · 03-02-2008, 05:28 PM

jillio: If I have been culturally insensitive then, again, I am sorry for that. I honestly never meant it. I mean what do I have to gain by doing so? Since everyone is on my back, then I will surrender my actions (maybe) and proclaim that I am in the wrong. How I am wrong is still a mystery to me. And once I grow to mature, to that mindset of the Deaf culture, then I can leave my old thinking behind and develop a healthier (fair) one. I will learn about the Deaf culture soon and I would my study will (I hope) reflect my errors and give me the much needed insights. Please recognize that I am new to all this so blunders will happen...it's a normal part of learning. I will also listen to the Deaf for more learning and adjustment.

Now what got me steamed was the statement that I am not respectful to the Deaf folks. Boy that statement got me hot under the collar.

AquaBlue · 03-02-2008, 05:35 PM

I don't see what you mean Reba. I can't see it. My comments in those entries seem perfectly fine to me. I do not understand the controversy. Truly. Since so many are not standing behind me then I must be mistaken because I would not translate my words as harmful. I am learning as I go.

Etoile · 03-02-2008, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AquaBlue

Etoile: I am not excluding anyone. All Terps are welcome to join in the discussion and answer my questions. Where (what post) exists where I said otherwise? What I meant is that ASL should be universal? How do I step on toes Etoile? Please tell me.

You are excluding everybody who isn't an interpreter! Honestly there are not that many terps on AllDeaf. There's a lot more deaf people than there are interpreters. Anybody who is fluent in ASL could have answered whether your "list of rules" from your book was right or not, but you only wanted replies from terps. See what I mean? That's disrespectful right there. You are choosing to ignore the vast wealth of knowledge we have on this forum...better to learn about ASL from deaf people, than from terps! Why did you pick only terps in the first place?

You are declaring that ASL should be universal, but ASL is not your language. It is the language of deaf people. It is insensitive to say that it is "crazy" that there are regional signs. (As I mentioned in that thread, English has regionalisms too!)

As for stepping on toes...what I mean is that you don't know a lot about Deaf culture right now. As a result, you're making assumptions about things that you don't know anything about. Oftentimes your assumptions have turned out to be wrong. Sometimes you acknowledge this, and sometimes you ignore it completely.

My biggest tip for you is: Respect what deaf people have to say. You'll do much better on AllDeaf and in general that way.

Etoile · 03-02-2008, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AquaBlue

I don't see what you mean Reba. I can't see it. My comments in those entries seem perfectly fine to me. I do not understand the controversy. Truly. Since so many are not standing behind me then I must be mistaken because I would not translate my words as harmful. I am learning as I go.

Ah! See this is a perfect example of what I just said. You don't understand why your words come across as insensitive, because you don't know about deaf culture. I totally get that you don't see what's wrong with your words, but like people have been saying...you need to learn more before you can make blanket statements.

I really think you're okay, AquaBlue, I just think you need to settle down and listen instead of being so gung-ho and ignoring things that don't fit with what you already believe.

AquaBlue · 03-02-2008, 05:43 PM

I see what you are saying Etoile. An innocent mistake on my part. I was not expecting that I was getting under your skin and those answering my replies now.

AquaBlue · 03-02-2008, 05:46 PM

Yes I must definitely have to learn about Deaf culture. That will set me straight.

03-02-2008, 12:37 PM	#121 (permalink)
AquaBlue ASL Student Join Date: May 2003 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 1,381	Ignore what people say? Is that what you said Etoile? That's funny. All I do is listen and if I need to adjust my ways, I do it. Show me where I have ignored what people say. I want to see it. __________________ Currently Reading: The Story of Edgar Sawtelle by David Wroblewski My Book List My Bipolar Page

03-02-2008, 12:50 PM	#122 (permalink)
AquaBlue ASL Student Join Date: May 2003 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 1,381	The Deaf are a strong, courageous, intellectual and proud people who deserve nothing more and nothing less than the outmost respect and honor given them. How can it be possible for me to not be respectful to such ones, to such a beautiful culture/people? What can't they do that a hearing person can? They are great and I look forward to not only learning about their culture but also entering it and sharing their pride- their Deaf pride. Come on now, let's maintain our association civil and let’s forget that this dispute ever took place. It was just a misunderstanding on your part. Let's move on. __________________ Currently Reading: The Story of Edgar Sawtelle by David Wroblewski My Book List My Bipolar Page

03-02-2008, 02:00 PM	#124 (permalink)
AquaBlue ASL Student Join Date: May 2003 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 1,381	Ah I am in agreement with you Tousi. But you are not stating the same thing as Anji and Etoile...not by a long shot. I am, as I said before, awaiting a Deaf culture book to arrive at my local public library. So my lessons are going to begin once it arrives. Now as for the Deaf gathering, I will attend one as soon as find one. The e-mails I sent have not been returned so I am in a wait-and-see mode now; if they do not reply, I will find other sources that can help me. If I can't find such I will press the two folks I e-mailed first. If no reply is given then I will personally go the college and ask for the director of the sign language department. I am going to a Deaf gathering even if it kills me. Tousi at least you didn't say that I disrespect the Deaf culture. I thank you for not doing so: Nothing could be further from the truth. __________________ Currently Reading: The Story of Edgar Sawtelle by David Wroblewski My Book List My Bipolar Page

03-02-2008, 03:22 PM	#126 (permalink)
AquaBlue ASL Student Join Date: May 2003 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 1,381	Terps, please don't give me the cold shoulder. I need your advice and experience. __________________ Currently Reading: The Story of Edgar Sawtelle by David Wroblewski My Book List My Bipolar Page

03-02-2008, 05:09 PM	#137 (permalink)
AquaBlue ASL Student Join Date: May 2003 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 1,381	Etoile: I am not excluding anyone. All Terps are welcome to join in the discussion and answer my questions. Where (what post) exists where I said otherwise? What I meant is that ASL should be universal? How do I step on toes Etoile? Please tell me. Thank so much Etoile for answering my questions. I wholeheartedly appreciate you doing so and I respect you fully because of your earnest replies. Reba: I was only asking that question out of curiosity. I did not mean any disrespect. I can see how it would be defined as a negative comment. For that I am sorry. __________________ Currently Reading: The Story of Edgar Sawtelle by David Wroblewski My Book List My Bipolar Page

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03-02-2008, 01:44 PM	#123 (permalink)
Tousi Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 8,260	Well, AB, you're the one who wanted the input. I agree with Anji, Etoile and some others that it is just simply axiomatic that language and culture go hand in hand. In fact,I would not worry so much about having every book on sign language ever published and getting set for the day you venture out. Get some of those books, especially the ones on the culture, if you must, but attend deaf socials, meetings, etc now rather than waiting until you think you are ready. Your progress will be much faster by leaps and bounds re: the mechanics of sign and the culture if you would just jump right in and leave all your sensibilities, defense mechanisms at home under the bed.

03-02-2008, 05:28 PM	#140 (permalink)
AquaBlue ASL Student Join Date: May 2003 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 1,381	jillio: If I have been culturally insensitive then, again, I am sorry for that. I honestly never meant it. I mean what do I have to gain by doing so? Since everyone is on my back, then I will surrender my actions (maybe) and proclaim that I am in the wrong. How I am wrong is still a mystery to me. And once I grow to mature, to that mindset of the Deaf culture, then I can leave my old thinking behind and develop a healthier (fair) one. I will learn about the Deaf culture soon and I would my study will (I hope) reflect my errors and give me the much needed insights. Please recognize that I am new to all this so blunders will happen...it's a normal part of learning. I will also listen to the Deaf for more learning and adjustment. Now what got me steamed was the statement that I am not respectful to the Deaf folks. Boy that statement got me hot under the collar. __________________ Currently Reading: The Story of Edgar Sawtelle by David Wroblewski My Book List My Bipolar Page

03-02-2008, 05:35 PM	#141 (permalink)
AquaBlue ASL Student Join Date: May 2003 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 1,381	I don't see what you mean Reba. I can't see it. My comments in those entries seem perfectly fine to me. I do not understand the controversy. Truly. Since so many are not standing behind me then I must be mistaken because I would not translate my words as harmful. I am learning as I go. __________________ Currently Reading: The Story of Edgar Sawtelle by David Wroblewski My Book List My Bipolar Page

03-02-2008, 05:43 PM	#144 (permalink)
AquaBlue ASL Student Join Date: May 2003 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 1,381	I see what you are saying Etoile. An innocent mistake on my part. I was not expecting that I was getting under your skin and those answering my replies now. __________________ Currently Reading: The Story of Edgar Sawtelle by David Wroblewski My Book List My Bipolar Page

03-02-2008, 05:46 PM	#145 (permalink)
AquaBlue ASL Student Join Date: May 2003 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 1,381	Yes I must definitely have to learn about Deaf culture. That will set me straight. __________________ Currently Reading: The Story of Edgar Sawtelle by David Wroblewski My Book List My Bipolar Page