DOJ posts new definition of service animal - Page 2

marcyp06 · 02-21-2011, 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OpheliaSpeaks

Disabled and elderly individuals who may benefit from the companionship of a pet, are permitted Emotional Support Animals in residential housing where the Fair Housing Act is implemented. The ADA does not and never has applied to housing situations. It is the Fair Housing Administration Act (FHAA) that defines Emotional Support Animal (ESA) and outlines who may have one, how to request a reasonable accommodation to keep one and what the procedure is for the landlord. Not all housing is covered under the FHAA.

So if a Deaf person is trying to get into an apartment ADA holds no ground? Im preparing for a situation trying to get a 90 lb Boxer/Rotwiler mix into an apartment with two Deaf adults. He is not a specially trained service dog but does provide protection and alert his owners at some sounds (most importantly someone near the door). Because of his size and breed mix many apartments are going to say no so im trying to get an idea of what steps need to be taken to assure he can stay with them.

**Reba** · 02-22-2011, 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by marcyp06

So if a Deaf person is trying to get into an apartment ADA holds no ground?

No, ADA doesn't apply but FHAA does. Check the FHAA guidelines if that housing is under FHAA.

dogmom · 02-22-2011, 07:45 AM

marcy, another thought is - many times if the dog in question such as you describe, has her CGC - Canine Good Citizen, which is a very basic initial test of dog/handler skills and control ....the testing comes with paperwork the handler turns in to AKC <American Kennel Club> - many times with the certificate received back from the AKC, this can provide some measure of influence on landlords and other types of situations <stay in hotels etc> With my Rotties the CGC is one of the first very basic things I try to do with them and ideally require of all my dogs. It shows the dog has gone to a basic dog class and has been tested and rated pass/fail on a list of basic items.
There are two trainers in my area who can offer the test and who sign - one is actually a terp. I've seen both of them at dog things here and there, so there is also a possibility that there may be someone like this where you and the people you mention are.
Unfortunately with any dog perceived to be a Rottie, Pit, or mix involving the two, there is so much more fear and bias than with other dogs that having something like the above COULD really make a big difference in many situations.

Good luck there-

marcyp06 · 02-22-2011, 10:27 AM

I will look into that. Unfortunatley we got him into training a bit late and then he has already moved two times and soon a third. He graduated from intermediate class but has digressed a bit and there are no trainers where I am living now. So we'll see what happens. I wanted to have him trained as a service dog but we had a few ro*******s after starting far too late anyways. I hope we can find a way to make it work.

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

dogmom · 02-22-2011, 11:49 AM

I hope so too -

for the picture!
Great looking dogs...brindle happens to be one of my favorite color patterns.

pek1 · 10-13-2011, 12:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OpheliaSpeaks

I think the best way to combat the "fakers" is to educate the masses. Education is truly lacking in this area of disability law which is why so many legit teams have access issues. Store owners don't know their rights. They CAN exclude a dog if it is defecating in the aisles, barking, being disruptive, etc.

Store owners and employees are permitted to ask if the dog is necessary because of a disability and they ARE permitted to ask what the dog DOES to mitigate the disability. Most store owners and workers are not aware of this, so when someone comes in with a pocket pooch screaming about their rights, they fear being sued and don't push the issue.

So, I think the best way to cut down on the fakers and "huggers" (those who claim the dog provides "comfort") is to educate the public about what the laws are surrounding public access to service dog teams.

Only two questions they can ask: 1. Is your dog a Service Dog? 2. If so, what does your dog do for you?

Those are the only two questions. Sorry for the delay in responses.

VacationGuy234 · 10-13-2011, 12:44 PM

What if you already have one that doesn't conform to the new guidelines? Do those animals now lose their license?

**Reba** · 10-13-2011, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pek1

Only two questions they can ask: 1. Is your dog a Service Dog? 2. If so, what does your dog do for you?

Those are the only two questions. Sorry for the delay in responses.

Long-time, no see.

**Reba** · 10-13-2011, 03:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VacationGuy234

What if you already have one that doesn't conform to the new guidelines? Do those animals now lose their license?

What license?

VacationGuy234 · 10-14-2011, 01:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

What license?

The tags that go on the dog and/or vest.

**Reba** · 10-14-2011, 03:12 PM

Wirelessly posted (BB Curve 9300)

Quote:

Originally Posted by VacationGuy234

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reba

What license?

The tags that go on the dog and/or vest.

Do you mean regular dog registration and rabies tags?

DeafRaptor · 10-16-2011, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VamPyroX

I agree.

They should also have service dogs tested frequently to ensure they're doing their jobs. I know some people who get a service dog and spoil them so bad that they stop acting like service dogs. Yet, they still have the right to go around with their service dogs because they're "service dogs".

I got a rescue dog (Leah), had her health and temperment tested, and found that she would make a good service dog. I found a specialized trainer (I used my tax stimulus payment to help pay for it) to show me the ropes and then I diligently trained Leah myself. While sometimes I jokingly say that she is spoiled, what I really mean is that she has a good life. I don't allow people to talk to her, feed her, pet her, or in anyway distract her so she is able to remain healthy, behaved, and focused on her duty. I agree with you that there are people out there that, after spoiling their dog, it stops functioning as a service dog and give the rest a bad name. When I see that, I also

.

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeafDoc1

Agreed, but at this time there are no certifying tests or documents needed to prove the dog is trained. People self-train dogs all the time; a few even do a good job. There are organizations pushing right now for a national certifying body and minimum performance testing. Better organizations already do this for their graduates.

I self-trained my service dog. While I didn't have to, I had her tested by the trainer who assisted me in the training, got her certified, got her registered with a legitimate registery (it was free so not infringing on service dog owners' rights), got her a service dog vest, and keep copies of the ADA and other related laws with me. I also continue to train her so that her skills don't atrophy. Not everyone who legitamately needs/benefits from a service dog has access to those same things and many places that offer those services don't do them the same way, which is why they do not have a set standard or even require it by law.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bottesini

So that means it is limited to dogs, but people who slap a vest on their pet dog still will be within the law without any certification required?

They would not be within the law as the dog would be a pet and not trained to conduct tasks specifically to assist in a disability that the person supposedly has (they must have a disability and the dog must be trained to specifically accomodate that disability). But you are right, in that it would be hard to "prove" and therefore makes it more frustrating for those of us with legitamate service animals.

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnQSiberians

There are simply things that a Service Dog can do that all the electronic device just cannot. For one, your dog still works when batteries and electricity fail… A dog can smell someone outside and warn you in a subtle way. For those who are older and all alone, they provide security and support. Also, a lot of people who inquire with me about Hearing Dogs have multiple disabilities, where hearing is just one task that is being mitigated.

I am one of those many people who have a hearing dog that is cross-trained for other "disabilities" (in quotes as I don't see deafness as a disability, although Leah is trained to assist with that deafness in all environments as I HATE having to depend on other people and Leah never minds but happily helps, but my other disabilities are actual disabilities and she is trained to assist with those).

**KristinaB** · 10-16-2011, 07:42 PM

My family is beginning to push for me to get a service dog. They want it for both hearing needs as well as for my falling all the time. Doctor has agreed that it might be a good idea. Doctor is also suggesting that I think seriously about moving to a scooter or wheelchair.

FireTiger · 10-17-2011, 02:52 PM

IIRC the full article allows monkeys in the next paragraph (for quadriplegics) and grandfathers in the current guide-ponies/horses but after those 'expire'/retire no further horses are allowed...

Sick of seeing 'hearing' turtles and 'companion' hamsters in stores...

02-22-2011, 10:27 AM	#34 (permalink)
marcyp06 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Ellensburg, WA Posts: 303	I will look into that. Unfortunatley we got him into training a bit late and then he has already moved two times and soon a third. He graduated from intermediate class but has digressed a bit and there are no trainers where I am living now. So we'll see what happens. I wanted to have him trained as a service dog but we had a few ro*****s after starting far too late anyways. I hope we can find a way to make it work. Uploaded with ImageShack.us __________________ Aspiring interpreter (with an auditory processing disorder) becoming more Deaf-minded everyday. Love this culture.** Last edited by marcyp06; 02-22-2011 at 10:28 AM. Reason: picture didnt show up

10-16-2011, 07:42 PM	#43 (permalink)
KristinaB New SDIT Deacon Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Land of the backstroke Posts: 13,772	My family is beginning to push for me to get a service dog. They want it for both hearing needs as well as for my falling all the time. Doctor has agreed that it might be a good idea. Doctor is also suggesting that I think seriously about moving to a scooter or wheelchair. __________________ Taking life one day at a time.

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02-22-2011, 07:45 AM	#33 (permalink)
dogmom Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 5,472	marcy, another thought is - many times if the dog in question such as you describe, has her CGC - Canine Good Citizen, which is a very basic initial test of dog/handler skills and control ....the testing comes with paperwork the handler turns in to AKC <American Kennel Club> - many times with the certificate received back from the AKC, this can provide some measure of influence on landlords and other types of situations <stay in hotels etc> With my Rotties the CGC is one of the first very basic things I try to do with them and ideally require of all my dogs. It shows the dog has gone to a basic dog class and has been tested and rated pass/fail on a list of basic items. There are two trainers in my area who can offer the test and who sign - one is actually a terp. I've seen both of them at dog things here and there, so there is also a possibility that there may be someone like this where you and the people you mention are. Unfortunately with any dog perceived to be a Rottie, Pit, or mix involving the two, there is so much more fear and bias than with other dogs that having something like the above COULD really make a big difference in many situations. Good luck there-

02-22-2011, 11:49 AM	#35 (permalink)
dogmom Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 5,472	I hope so too - for the picture! Great looking dogs...brindle happens to be one of my favorite color patterns.

10-13-2011, 12:44 PM	#37 (permalink)
VacationGuy234 Registered User Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 2,794	What if you already have one that doesn't conform to the new guidelines? Do those animals now lose their license?

10-17-2011, 02:52 PM	#44 (permalink)
FireTiger Registered User Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Arl, Jax, NE-FL, SE-USA, Earth, Solar System, Milky Way Galaxy, Local Group, Universe A, Mutiverse 1 Posts: 518	IIRC the full article allows monkeys in the next paragraph (for quadriplegics) and grandfathers in the current guide-ponies/horses but after those 'expire'/retire no further horses are allowed... Sick of seeing 'hearing' turtles and 'companion' hamsters in stores...