Schools Fight Families Over Autism Service Dogs - Page 5

FireTiger · 11-03-2011, 06:24 PM

It is NOT a reasonable job for a dog to 24/7 be a parent... that's what parents are for...

Tethering anything to a dog is dangerous... even well trained dogs can have off days...

so sparky decides he's fast enough to get across the street to chase a rabbit... to bad tethered child Tommy is scared of the color -Purple- and there is a -purple- chalk drawing in the middle of the street that Tommy won't cross... has a meltdown... in a road...

Speaking of therapy, R/C cars can help.

We have several different problems:

Are service animals appropriate for children (my opinion no)

Should any service animal be tethered to a human (my opinion no)

Is autism a disability that can be mitigated by a trained service dog (yes, on a case-by-case basis)

Is a dog a life threatening allergen? (The ADA does not recognize allergies as preclusion for service animals)

Should a service animal handler be able to diminish discomfort of others, clean up after, and care for their animal... (in 99% cases, yes- alone and w/o supervision - the other 1% are the persons pared with the monkeys due to severe quadriplegia )

FireTiger · 11-03-2011, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

The word, "ironic" appears multiple times within the lyrics.

I never said this was, "my taste in music"... That song just popped in my head after I read the prior post.

I meant "appropriately"- my spelling defects made the computer choose the wrong word. Sorry.

jillio · 11-03-2011, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

The word, "ironic" appears multiple times within the lyrics.

I never said this was, "my taste in music"... That song just popped in my head after I read the prior post.

Songs that "pop" in our heads are generally those they we have listened to repeatedly. Just sayin'.

**deafskeptic** · 11-03-2011, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

Songs that "pop" in our heads are generally those they we have listened to repeatedly. Just sayin'.

Thriller, Jingle bells and Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer are the only songs I can recognize. I listened to Thriller so many times that I can recognize it even years later. It always begins with a scream.

And my fashion style is influenced by bands. I doubt I'm the only deaf one who doesn't know the songs but copies from rock bands.

jillio · 11-03-2011, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deafskeptic

Thriller, Jingle bells and Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer are the only songs I can recognize. I listened to Thriller so many times that I can recognize it even years later. It always begins with a scream.

And my fashion style is influenced by bands. I doubt I'm the only deaf one who doesn't know the songs but copies from rock bands.

I doubt you are either. CSign just said that this wasn't necessarily her taste, but the song just "popped" into her head. Those things that "pop" into our consciousness that way are generally things we are familiar with.

**deafskeptic** · 11-03-2011, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

I doubt you are either. CSign just said that this wasn't necessarily her taste, but the song just "popped" into her head. Those things that "pop" into our consciousness that way are generally things we are familiar with.

Yeah. I tend to like the macabre and oddly enough Christmas songs which is a strange combination of tastes.

Jane B. · 11-04-2011, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

I doubt you are either. CSign just said that this wasn't necessarily her taste, but the song just "popped" into her head. Those things that "pop" into our consciousness that way are generally things we are familiar with.

She could be familiar with it for a number of reasons including it being played frequently over the sound system someplace where she goes often.

jillio · 11-04-2011, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jane B.

She could be familiar with it for a number of reasons including it being played frequently over the sound system someplace where she goes often.

That is generally not enough exposure for the type of recall exhibited and claimed.

CSign · 11-04-2011, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jane B.

She could be familiar with it for a number of reasons including it being played frequently over the sound system someplace where she goes often.

You have a very good point. I'm really not sure why some are so insistent on the fact that is "my type of music" or whatever. I always pay close attention to lyrics, and will often think of different songs during different situations. Doesn't mean I necessarily like the song or the artist, just that the message is relevant.

jillio · 11-04-2011, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

You have a very good point. I'm really not sure why some are so insistent on the fact that is "my type of music" or whatever. I always pay close attention to lyrics, and will often think of different songs during different situations. Doesn't mean I necessarily like the song or the artist, just that the message is relevant.

But the deaf generally don't so your reference was a bit innappropriate, as they have tried to tell you.

**shel90** · 11-04-2011, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

You have a very good point. I'm really not sure why some are so insistent on the fact that is "my type of music" or whatever. I always pay close attention to lyrics, and will often think of different songs during different situations. Doesn't mean I necessarily like the song or the artist, just that the message is relevant.

I get a lot of FB statuses from my hearing friends about the lyrics they can relate to to their everyday lives. To this day, I dont get it. I like music but I was never able to understand the lyrics like my hearing friends could as a kid. They were able to relate them to real life situations while I spent just memorizing them so I could be like them. They held absulotely no meaning for me.

ASL (which is my 2nd language I became fluent at around 28 years old) poetry held much much more meaning to me.

CSign · 11-04-2011, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

But the deaf generally don't so your reference was a bit innappropriate, as they have tried to tell you.

And that's why there is an entire thread about...
What song are you listening to?

**TXgolfer** · 11-05-2011, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

When the North Star Foundation places a dog with a child with autism, our primary emphasis is on appropriate early socialization. This means the puppy is subjected to experiences that simulate the experience he/she will have with the child. Our strongest commitment is to finding the optimal fit between child and dog. We put considerable energy into teaching the child to interact with the dog in ways that enhance bonding. Because the quality of the relationship matters more than any other variable, it is essential that early interactions are supervised, more so than might be necessary for an adult with mobility problems.

often refer applicants to Canine Companions

Service Dog Placements for Children with Autism

These are companion dogs used to address behavioral and neurological issues found with autism. The goal is to teach bonding using an animal and then transfer those skills to interaction with other people.

Quite different that the goal and purpose of a service dog. As beneficial, in different circumstances and application, yes. The same, no.

Yet your link ^^^ says "Service Dog" Perhaps your link is wrong too.

Quote:

Service Dog Placements for Children with Autism

Creating a service dog placement for a child with autism differs from creating placements between service dogs and physically challenged adults. From puppy hood on, the philosophy of training the dog and the timetable for placement has to be tailored to the unique needs of the child and move in tandem with the dog's natural development.

In traditional service animal programs, dogs are placed with human partners when the dogs are approximately two years of age, and they arrive fully trained. New owners learn handling skills within the space of two or three weeks. At North Star, we create placements when the dog is still a puppy, in order to facilitate the strongest bond possible, and to insure the dog's training matches the child's needs.

**Jiro** · 11-05-2011, 01:56 AM

CSign - is this dog certified as service dog?

CSign · 11-05-2011, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jiro

CSign - is this dog certified as service dog?

If you are referring to the original article, it seems that it is a certified service dog.

jillio · 11-05-2011, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TXgolfer

Yet your link ^^^ says "Service Dog" Perhaps your link is wrong too.

Uhhh...did you see the "quite different" in front of my reference to a service dog?

Read carefully.

jillio · 11-05-2011, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

If you are referring to the original article, it seems that it is a certified service dog.

I didn't see where it said the dog was certified.

**TXgolfer** · 11-05-2011, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

Uhhh...did you see the "quite different" in front of my reference to a service dog?

Read carefully.

Did you see your link that says service? THAT is what I referred to.

**TXgolfer** · 11-05-2011, 01:04 PM

BTw why didn't you include all of this.....

Quote:

I often refer applicants to Canine Companions for Independence (CCI) (Canine Companions for Independence - Canine Companions for Independence) and other traditional programs, though there are clear drawbacks to bypassing puppy hood and placing a child with autism with an older dog instead

FireTiger · 11-05-2011, 05:06 PM

A service animal need not be certified by anybody according to the ADA...

It would be nice if they did and certificate-people were paid by the government to run around and given certs out to home-trained dogs.

**Jiro** · 11-05-2011, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

If you are referring to the original article, it seems that it is a certified service dog.

you don't sound so certain.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jillio

I didn't see where it said the dog was certified.

same here, jillio.

if the dog is a certified service dog... no establishment can refuse a person with service dog. It appears that this dog in article is a companion dog rather than a certified service dog otherwise... we wouldn't have this kind of problem especially at schools.

**TXgolfer** · 11-06-2011, 12:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jiro

you don't sound so certain.

same here, jillio.

if the dog is a certified service dog... no establishment can refuse a person with service dog. It appears that this dog in article is a companion dog rather than a certified service dog otherwise... we wouldn't have this kind of problem especially at schools.

It appears Levi is certified

emily ainsworth - Topics - Macleans.ca

Autistic girl wins apology over service dog ban - Edmonton - CBC News

A Guide (Dog?) for Good PR « What's New in Public Relations

jillio · 11-06-2011, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TXgolfer

BTw why didn't you include all of this.....

Because it doesn't alter my point, or the goals and purpose of using a therapeutic animal for a person with autism. But if you feel the need to include it, be my guest. Doesn't alter anything, but does provide evidence of your intention to nit pick rather than contribute purposefully to the discussion.

jillio · 11-06-2011, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FireTiger

A service animal need not be certified by anybody according to the ADA...

It would be nice if they did and certificate-people were paid by the government to run around and given certs out to home-trained dogs.

This incident was in Canada. They are not bound by our ADA.

jillio · 11-06-2011, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TXgolfer

It appears Levi is certified

emily ainsworth - Topics - Macleans.ca

Autistic girl wins apology over service dog ban - Edmonton - CBC News

A Guide (Dog?) for Good PR « What's New in Public Relations

Nope. Nothing showing that the dog was "certified" as a service animal.

CSign · 11-06-2011, 11:21 AM

While it doesn't explicitly state the dog is a "certified service animal", if you read the article in it's entirety you'll see that the dog functions on more than one level for the child. I recall reading that the service animal must assist in at least two areas for it to be considered a service dog. So, in the case referenced at the start of this thread, it is a service dog.

**Jiro** · 11-06-2011, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

While it doesn't explicitly state the dog is a "certified service animal", if you read the article in it's entirety you'll see that the dog functions on more than one level for the child. I recall reading that the service animal must assist in at least two areas for it to be considered a service dog. So, in the case referenced at the start of this thread, it is a service dog.

no I do not care for what you believe that should be qualified as a service dog. This legal system does not operate on what you believe in or what you feel like. If it's the law, then it's a law. Plain and simple.

If this dog is a certified service dog... then this dog is protected by federal law but in this article, it appears that the dog is not certified. You don't have to raise a ruckus in here. You can simply end it all by proving that this dog is certified rather than defending on what you believe should be right. Simple.

**Bottesini** · 11-06-2011, 01:38 PM

This is from the official government website. Of course it is a service dog. There is not a requirement for licensing or certification by state or local government.

This is law.

Quote:

: The ADA defines a service animal as any guide dog, signal dog, or other animal individually trained to provide assistance to an individual with a disability. If they meet this definition, animals are considered service animals under the ADA regardless of whether they have been licensed or certified by a state or local government.

Commonly Asked Questions About Service Animals in Places of Business

**TXgolfer** · 11-06-2011, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSign

While it doesn't explicitly state the dog is a "certified service animal", if you read the article in it's entirety you'll see that the dog functions on more than one level for the child. I recall reading that the service animal must assist in at least two areas for it to be considered a service dog. So, in the case referenced at the start of this thread, it is a service dog.

Meh, even the link she provided calls them service dogs. My link says he Levi had a vest and papers. *shrug*

Quote:

While autism service dogs are new, they are proving to be very helpful to children with autism. The thing to remember is that the dog must be task trained to specifically help your child, in order to be given protection under the ADA.

Below are 7 ways that an autism service dog could benefit your child in school and out of school:

1. The dog can assist children with autism safely access different environment’s. This could help your child become more independent and also help with transitions, which can be difficult for children with autism.

2. The dog can be a calming influence and give a sense of security to your child.

3. The dog can actually help your child focus on academic and social tasks. The reason that this happens is not known by many trainers of these service dogs, but it is a good side effect.

4. The dog can be tethered to your child to prevent the child from wandering away, which a lot of children with autism are prone to do.

5. The dog can actually track and search for your child if the child does wander away (if the child is not tethered). This takes out a lot of parents fear about their child getting lost in school or public places.

6. The dog can try and stop a child’s repetitive behavior by nudging the child. This does take specific training for the dog on what your child’s behaviors are. But the hope is that the child will much rather pet the dog than continue the repetitive behavior.

7. Another positive side affect of having a dog is that it appears to help the child become more social with their peers. Again the trainers of these dogs do not know why this happens, but the dog does seem to help the child engage more in social activity.

Several organizations have sprouted up that train dogs with special service dog certification for this purpose. Several names are: 4 Paws for ability, Autism Service Dogs of America, and Dogs for autism.

Autism Service Dog

Since this is new, maybe you just can't teach an old dog new tricks.

You can always visit the cute Autism Doggies on Facebook

Canada since Levi is Canadian
Welcome to Facebook - Log In, Sign Up or Learn More

**Jiro** · 11-06-2011, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bottesini

This is from the official government website. Of course it is a service dog. There is not a requirement for licensing or certification by state or local government.

This is law.

Commonly Asked Questions About Service Animals in Places of Business

It would be in person's best interest to get their animal certified to avoid headache. From your post

Quote:

The ADA defines a service animal as any guide dog, signal dog, or other animal individually trained to provide assistance to an individual with a disability. If they meet this definition, animals are considered service animals under the ADA regardless of whether they have been licensed or certified by a state or local government.

why go thru headache and legal issue just to argue whether or not if your animal meet "this definition" as service animal? Get it certified and everything is peachy.

11-05-2011, 01:56 AM	#134 (permalink)
Jiro Aparecium Deletrius Legil Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: The Soprano State Posts: 61,187	CSign - is this dog certified as service dog? __________________ - Don't forget to buy Jiro's Special Edition Sunglasses for $19.95

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

11-03-2011, 06:24 PM	#121 (permalink)
FireTiger Registered User Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Arl, Jax, NE-FL, SE-USA, Earth, Solar System, Milky Way Galaxy, Local Group, Universe A, Mutiverse 1 Posts: 518	It is NOT a reasonable job for a dog to 24/7 be a parent... that's what parents are for... Tethering anything to a dog is dangerous... even well trained dogs can have off days... so sparky decides he's fast enough to get across the street to chase a rabbit... to bad tethered child Tommy is scared of the color -Purple- and there is a -purple- chalk drawing in the middle of the street that Tommy won't cross... has a meltdown... in a road... Speaking of therapy, R/C cars can help. We have several different problems: Are service animals appropriate for children (my opinion no) Should any service animal be tethered to a human (my opinion no) Is autism a disability that can be mitigated by a trained service dog (yes, on a case-by-case basis) Is a dog a life threatening allergen? (The ADA does not recognize allergies as preclusion for service animals) Should a service animal handler be able to diminish discomfort of others, clean up after, and care for their animal... (in 99% cases, yes- alone and w/o supervision - the other 1% are the persons pared with the monkeys due to severe quadriplegia )

Today
Deafness	Sponsored Links __________________ This advertising will not be shown in this way to registered members. Register your free account today and become a member on AllDeaf.com

11-05-2011, 05:06 PM	#140 (permalink)
FireTiger Registered User Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Arl, Jax, NE-FL, SE-USA, Earth, Solar System, Milky Way Galaxy, Local Group, Universe A, Mutiverse 1 Posts: 518	A service animal need not be certified by anybody according to the ADA... It would be nice if they did and certificate-people were paid by the government to run around and given certs out to home-trained dogs.

11-06-2011, 11:21 AM	#146 (permalink)
CSign Registered User Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Best Coast, USA Posts: 3,216	While it doesn't explicitly state the dog is a "certified service animal", if you read the article in it's entirety you'll see that the dog functions on more than one level for the child. I recall reading that the service animal must assist in at least two areas for it to be considered a service dog. So, in the case referenced at the start of this thread, it is a service dog.